Makeup is oppression.. end of story

[kawaiimeows]

Originally Posted by vogueboy /img/forum/go_quote.gif
I think this thread is segueing...

Interesting you bring up societal norms or standards of what beauty "should" be.

I was shocked when I started working in the editorial fashion world where the beauty standards and ideals in the magazines are portrayed by the photography and mostly by the ads that say "this is your ideal beauty for you to fit in"

Nothing was more sad to me when I kept getting 13 - 15 year olds that do the international circuit that sit in my therapy chair and tell me the horror stories of constantly trying to keep up as the new "It Face" of the industry. But this is the wrong thread to get in to the nitty gritty details here.

Suffice it to say I've seen a lot of breakdowns, burn-outs, walk-outs, and retirements at the 15 - 16 year old mark. Those who have a good sense of who they are, make it to 18. But we all know the conundrum being in that age range. After that (18) they are put out to pasture, regulated to department store flyer / catalogue work. Can anyone say bitter much? Which is what I have to listen to when I do these catalogue gigs.

So what feeds what? Ads? Industry? Art? Life? How do young girls growing up keep up with just "one" pressure? Never mind peer pressure or boyfriends etc. but they manage to do it.

So many of my favorite models have faded or just totally disappeared because of everything mentioned above. It's definitely a fascinating topic.

 

[americanclassic]

I empathize with why you wouldn't want to wear makeup every day, but I wouldn't say makeup is oppression; the very need to feel you should fix/hide your 'flaws' is the source of oppression, if any. makeup and skincare products are just two different ways around the same end result, and it's strange to say one method is oppressive while the other should be lauded (since your initial post recommended ditching makeup in favor of skincare products). you get what I'm trying to say?

Originally Posted by aquaeyes77 /img/forum/go_quote.gif

it is unhealthy to rely on a full face of makeup to cover your flaws just to appease others so you'll feel less judged.

 

[OiiO]

Originally Posted by americanclassic /img/forum/go_quote.gif

makeup and skincare products are just two different ways around the same end result, and it's strange to say one method is oppressive while the other should be lauded (since your initial post recommended ditching makeup in favor of skincare products). you get what I'm trying to say?

Several people have brought it up and she still didn't respond.

I'm starting to think it was all about US vs Canada to begin with...

 

[Baberanza]

Originally Posted by OiiO /img/forum/go_quote.gif

Several people have brought it up and she still didn't respond.

I'm starting to think it was all about US vs Canada to begin with...

That's how I started feeling.

 

[zadidoll]

I haven't read all the posts made here and I'm not however my own opinion is that make up is anything but oppressive. Makeup is a form of art in the right hands. How you use it for your own personal use or on someone else can enhance a person's beauty or bring to life a hideous monster from the depth of your nightmares. Make-up to me is wonderful.

​

 

[aquaeyes77]

Originally Posted by OiiO /img/forum/go_quote.gif

Several people have brought it up and she still didn't respond.

I'm starting to think it was all about US vs Canada to begin with...

I'm guessing you're thinking I'm contradicting myself? I suppose I am a little. I think what I only meant to say is that skin care products outweight the benefits of makeup for me because they deliver rather lasting improvement. Take it or leave it at that..

The Canada vs.the U.S tangent only happened because I responded to a Canadian poster (vogueboy) about his opinion regarding what type of makeup he sees women wearing in the streets of Toronto. He had said something along the lines of "They don't wear much past the teens and they don't seem to follow makeup trends ect." - and I just reminded him that in Canada people are fairly less makeup and fashion savvy compared to the U.S so this was only reflective of Canadian society.

 

[makeupbyomar]

I haven't read all the posts made here and I'm not however my own opinion is that make up is anything but oppressive. Makeup is a form of art in the right hands. How you use it for your own personal use or on someone else can enhance a person's beauty or bring to life a hideous monster from the depth of your nightmares. Make-up to me is wonderful.

​

Good pics of those great make-ups Zadi obviously that was the student competition? Was the rest of the talent fairly creative?

 

[biitchstix]

Feminists... 

But seriously, why on earth would you come into a forum called makeuptalk just to belittle and put-down girls who choose to express themselves in a way that you don't personally like? By telling us that we're being 'oppressed' is completely dismissing and invalidating our choice to take part in a career/passion/hobby that we genuinely enjoy, weather you understand that or not.

 

[zadidoll]

Yes. In fact the girl on the left was the one that won first place. The costumes were amazing as were the makeup on each student. I was once again blown away by the talent and creativity these people have. I honestly don't see how any one could think makeup was oppressive other than the person is using the wrong product on herself or himself.

 

[aquaeyes77]

Did you even read the rest of my replies on this thread? I revised my original statement to "Makeup can be oppressive to certain women if they're relying on because they feel like they have to hide their flaws out of shame" - or something along those lines. I'm not telling anyone what to do - I was only giving a personal account of my feelings on this issue. Let it fall on stony ground for all I care.

 

[makeupbyomar]

Just to clarify... The girl without the wristband??? I know you said left... Do you know off-hand what she won? At the Toronto show, most of the student competition was fantasy-based type make-ups like the one in the top photo. That prosthetic make-up looks pretty badass as well. Your last sentence got me thinking... As it reminded me of a street woman I saw downtown Toronto about ten years ago. Her lipstick looked like Ronald McDonald's lips, her eyeshadow looked like Heath Ledgers' Joker eye make-up, but it was blue, and her blush was two round red circles. As a Make-up Artist I've always maintained: there is no right or wrong way to do make-up, it's just interpretation. Sure there's the textbook rules we all learn at first, but once you get to know those rules, you can break them. That street woman I saw is an extreme example of this, mental illness or no, as a professional, I was intrigued by her application for all the world to see.

 

[aquaeyes77]

Originally Posted by vogueboy /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Just to clarify... The girl without the wristband??? I know you said left... Do you know off-hand what she won?

At the Toronto show, most of the student competition was fantasy-based type make-ups like the one in the top photo.

That prosthetic make-up looks pretty badass as well.

Your last sentence got me thinking... As it reminded me of a street woman I saw downtown Toronto about ten years ago. Her lipstick looked like Ronald McDonald's lips, her eyeshadow looked like Heath Ledgers' Joker eye make-up, but it was blue, and her blush was two round red circles. As a Make-up Artist I've always maintained: there is no right or wrong way to do make-up, it's just interpretation.

Sure there's the textbook rules we all learn at first, but once you get to know those rules, you can break them.

That street woman I saw is an extreme example of this, mental illness or no, as a professional, I was intrigued by her application for all the world to see.

I'm sure she wasn't all that together in her head if she was going around like that. It sounds terrifying but a bit funny.

 

[zadidoll]

Originally Posted by vogueboy /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Just to clarify... The girl without the wristband??? I know you said left... Do you know off-hand what she won?

At the Toronto show, most of the student competition was fantasy-based type make-ups like the one in the top photo.

That prosthetic make-up looks pretty badass as well.

Your last sentence got me thinking... As it reminded me of a street woman I saw downtown Toronto about ten years ago. Her lipstick looked like Ronald McDonald's lips, her eyeshadow looked like Heath Ledgers' Joker eye make-up, but it was blue, and her blush was two round red circles. As a Make-up Artist I've always maintained: there is no right or wrong way to do make-up, it's just interpretation.

Sure there's the textbook rules we all learn at first, but once you get to know those rules, you can break them.

That street woman I saw is an extreme example of this, mental illness or no, as a professional, I was intrigued by her application for all the world to see.

I believe she won beauty/fantasy category since Caitlyn Groves won the character/prosthetic category.

​

Image from Vancouver Film School Facebook.​

 

[makeupbyomar]

Looks like there is a cash prize as well... I was just wondering if part of winning was a job offer at a creature shop or as a daily on a make-up heavy show like Walking Dead or American Horror Story? Just curious, as I didn't attend the winners announcements at the Toronto Show, so I didn't know what prizes were awarded.

 

[makeupbyomar]

I'm sure she wasn't all that together in her head if she was going around like that. It sounds terrifying but a bit funny.

Yeah some sort of mental or medical illness, based on the look in her eyes and what she was asking me. At any rate it was her make-up look that intrigued me.

 

[satojoko]

As a Canadian woman myself who grew up with constant skin problems and who loves my makeup hobby - as well as a feminist who DETESTS Tim Hortons AND stupid Canadians - I can honestly say that I would avoid the original poster of this thread like the plague. They've got their head securely lodged up their backside and obviously haven't seen or experienced much of the world, or even their own country. No extremes in Canada when it comes to those who are dirt poor and obscenely wealthy? You've obviously been on the crack pipe, dear. The UN obviously sees problems great enough in this country to have paid us a visit last year. We are the FIRST AND ONLY 'developed country' in the history of the UN to have received such an ass-slapping from them. THAT'S how abysmal life is in this country for the many millions of Canadians who live well below the poverty level. Our arrogant prick of a prime minister refused to meet with the UN however, choosing to keep his head up his backside, denying that Canada is full of people whose kids aren't getting proper nutrition & even going to school hungry. In addition, I would far rather shop in the US - and DO - on a regular basis simply because the vast majority of Canadians don't give a damn about customer service as a whole. Canadians sure expect to be treated like royalty where ever they are though, when they themselves are done dealing with customers at their jobs. This crap attitude is rampant in Canada, in all parts of society and life here. The majority of Canadians only care when it's THEM getting the shaft. Whether that be issues related to poverty, homelessness, human rights, women's rights, whatever. Even breaking laws. Wanna guess how many Canadian drivers I see on the side of the road, being stopped for speeding or cutting other people off - just during one of my trips over there? Every single one I come across! Canadians seem to think that rules & regulations don't apply to them at all. How about the many Canadians I see witching out teenagers working in American stores - sales people - for the most insignificant of matters? Not to mention that Americans show a great deal more notice to those around themselves - opening doors for others, offering to help carry people's groceries to their cars, etc. Canadians are far more self-absorbed & totally ignore these opportunities to help others out. They can't be bothered because THEY'RE BUSY. Even my non-Canadian husband notices these issues since moving to this country a few years ago. Canada has gotten progressively worse over the past 10-20 years, NOT better. We're creating our own cesspool this side of the border, and completely & utterly blind to this fact. Makeup is the bloody LEAST of Canadian women's problems. As for 'luxury stores' and in-your-face displays of wealth, I can ascertain from your comments that you very likely haven't spent any amount of time living outside of North America where both these things are rampant. I'm in the US every couple of weeks and have yet to see ANYBODY with a US license plate driving around in a luxury car or wearing boatloads of gold jewelry, diamonds, whatever. If you truly want to see THAT, I highly suggest you leave the continent. Taking my feminist-makeup-wearing CANADIAN ass to the bathroom now to wash my slap off before bed. I suggest you rack up a little more life experience before making such ludicrous, humiliating posts. You embarrass ALL Canadians who are capable of thinking for themselves & who actually know the ugly history - past & and not so past - of this country. Or just stick your head in your oven. Your grey matter is a tad undercooked.

 

[makeupbyomar]

Yes, thank you. We get it.

Your dissertation can be applied to every country's internal issues...

I am bringing this thread back to the "make-up" components of this conversation, as it already has been established that make-up is not oppression. It has been proven historically and culturally that this is the case, for example It has been used to attract mates and intimidate enemies. Perhaps viewpoints in the last century and the begining of this one, have this view point shifted or changed? Or has it? Discuss...

 

[Baberanza]

Originally Posted by vogueboy /img/forum/go_quote.gif

Yes, thank you. We get it.

Your dissertation can be applied to every country's internal issues...

I am bringing this thread back to the "make-up" components of this conversation, as it already has been established that make-up is not oppression. It has been proven historically and culturally that this is the case, for example It has been used to attract mates and intimidate enemies. Perhaps viewpoints in the last century and the begining of this one, have this view point shifted or changed? Or has it? Discuss...

I think in our modern, current world, people are abusing certain things. I feel like depending on makeup to look pretty is akin to wearing certain attire or clothes too tight, to feel smaller. For the longest time, I'd buy the smallest size that fit just because I felt thinner and happier. Then (with my boyfriend's unknowing support of my body) I ditched that idea. It was unhealthy to me. Hollister's jeans do not stretch and I need jeans that do. Although I have a size 2 waist, I don't have a size 2 butt, or thighs so trying to squeeze into Hollister's size 3 skinny jeans took some time and belt loop breaking. I feel like people all over the place can make something unhealthy to themselves. 

We still use makeup to attract mates. Just like clothes. On the first date, do you go out to dinner in sweats? No. So I would agree with your comment about using makeup to attract someone. In my culture, the only intimidation from using makeup is by making others think you're prettier than you really are or that they aren't pretty enough, causing them to back off. 

I think the viewpoint has shifted to fit our current cultures/time periods. But alas, I believe you are technically correct. 

 

[satojoko]

Cosmetics and skin care products have been used for thousands of years, and they've been used for many reasons. I can't stand to hear women who think they're 'liberated feminists' spew crap like this. I'm not about to have anybody - woman or man - dictate to me what I should or should not be doing. My face, my body, my choice. End of story. The fact that my country is populated by 20-something year old girls who think like this absolutely astounds me. Obviously our education system hasn't improved over the last generation. I'm a married 44 year old woman who wears makeup when & where I choose, for no other reason than I like to wear it. It's a creative outlet for me, a hobby. Claiming that it's not 'creative' just because it's not something I put down on paper is absolutely ludicrous. There are countless ways of being creative. For somebody to try and put limits on my creativity, telling me what *is* and *isn't* legitimately 'creative' is even more ludicrous, and is in fact OPPRESSION in itself. And actually, I have been known to show up for dates in the past with not an ounce of makeup on and yes, in sweats It told me a great deal about the guy I was on a 'date' with. It saved me a lot of wasted time on crappy relationships. I learned quite early in life that I shouldn't be doing anything, including using makeup to attract the attention of men, that demeans me as a human being in any way.

 

[zadidoll]

Aquaeyes - keep it civil. Your last post was not validated due to attacking another member. Not allowed.