# I need some outside opinions...



## Solimar (Jul 12, 2007)

I have a question, and I definitely need some outside opinions.

I am twenty years old, I'm getting married in November. I come from an abusive family, with a father who is constantly on drugs, was verbally, mentally and physically abusive when I was growing up, and a mother who is depressed, but started doing well on meds when I was a teenager. I also have an 18 year old brother who is verbally and somewhat physically abusive when my mom and I ever see him.

Basically, I have this intense hatred for my father. He treated me like nothing when I was growing up, and when he wasn't treating me that way, I was utterly ignored. My mother did the same thing, but my real issue is with him. He made my life a living hell, and the last time I saw him was on my birthday. Other than that, I see him once a year (birthday) and never email, or speak to him otherwise. I have not seen my dad's side of the family in something like a year and half, and they make no effort to get into contact with me at all.

I am planning on having an actual ceremony with friends and family next July, and I was wondering if it was okay not to invite my father? I mean, I know it is, but I feel like a bad daughter if I do not. I am guilt tripping myself into doing it because as much as I hate him, I don't want him to hate me more than he already does. I would feel horrible if he wasn't there and genuinely does have a heart and would care that he was not invited. I am just terrifed he could make a scene, like he does if he sees my mom in a store, or show up drunk and high, like he did to my graduation. I want to write him an email and tell him how much I dislike him, and explain how I feel...and I want a conversation with my whole family to get those things resolved. If I can't put it behind me, and I can't find some peaceful ground, I would like to keep him out of it. But is it even worth the effort? I am scared to talk to him or email him, and I am scared to have him at my wedding or any other occasion, actually.

The other thing that is influencing me is my mom. She thinks by seeing my family or my dad I am betraying her. (However, she emails my dad on holiday's and birthday to say happy whatever...and knowing this is the man that abused her and her children). I feel like I am in a tug of war and it is a catch 22.

I truly do not know what to do. I know I may seem dumb, but you can't see the picture when you're in the frame, and this, though it may not seem serious, is bugging the hell out of me. Ideas?

Thanks, ladies.


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## Manda (Jul 12, 2007)

If you don't want him at your wedding, you don't have to. It's YOUR day, do what you want and don't let anyone tell you that it's the *right* thing to have your father there. From what you wrote, it doesn't seem like he was very fatherly to you, and if he behaved abdly at your graduation, you don't want or need that kind of drama on your wedding day.


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## Duchess Ravenwaves (Jul 12, 2007)

I agree with Manda, it's better to avoid any drama, on your special day.


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## Solimar (Jul 12, 2007)

But I feel that by doing that, I am being a bad daughter and I am in turn causing more drama. Haha.


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## Manda (Jul 12, 2007)

If you're not totally against it there's always the little white lie- "The invitation must have gotten lost in the mail!" Kidding!...sort of





Don't think you're a bad daughter, you can always go Bridezilla lol


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## Shelley (Jul 12, 2007)

I know how you feel. I grew up in a very abusive, destructive family. There is one part of me that wants or tries to love them, another part that totally hates them. It does feel very confusing.

I think writing or emailing your dad is a good idea. Tell him how the abuse made/makes you feel. I think it would make you feel better to get this off your chest even if it doesn't solve everything. You shouldn't have to feel uncomfortable at your own wedding, and from what I read in your post, you said your dad could possibly show up drunk or cause a scene which will make it very uncomfortable for you. Does your fiance know what your father is like, have you discussed your concerns with him?

Another thing.. you mentioned you would feel like a bad daughter if you didn't invite him. I know what you mean by that, but I have learned that abusive people will try to make their victims/survivors feel guilty, twist things around, blame, and make out like we are the bad person, not them.


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## Solimar (Jul 12, 2007)

YES, exactly. My dad has blamed the riff between us on me, and has denied abuse, etc (though members of my family told me they knew, however act like it never happened). It beats you down to such a low point, and it's really hard to get out of.

My fiance has refused on more than one occasion to meet my dad. He knows what he is like, and told me point blank that my dad is an ******* and doesn't want to see or speak to him after looking at my dad's MySpace. (Yes, he is 50 and has a myspace, haha...) I have discussed my concerns with him, but my fiance has been having issues lately giving me his real opinion rather than saying "I want you to do whatever you want to do"!


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## StereoXGirl (Jul 12, 2007)

Originally Posted by *Sincerely Me* /img/forum/go_quote.gif YES, exactly. My dad has blamed the riff between us on me, and has denied abuse, etc (though members of my family told me they knew, however act like it never happened). It beats you down to such a low point, and it's really hard to get out of.
My fiance has refused on more than one occasion to meet my dad. He knows what he is like, and told me point blank that my dad is an ******* and doesn't want to see or speak to him after looking at my dad's MySpace. (Yes, he is 50 and has a myspace, haha...) I have discussed my concerns with him, but my fiance has been having issues lately giving me his real opinion rather than saying "I want you to do whatever you want to do"!

It sounds like your fiance' wouldn't want your father at the wedding. It also sounds like you don't want your dad there. This doesn't make you a bad daughter...he's a bad father. Don't put the blame on yourself.
Enjoy your special day!


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## BeneBaby (Jul 12, 2007)

Wow...did we grow up in the same house??? I know exactly how you feel. I am actually dreading the day I get married (i'm not even engaged) because my family is so dysfunctional. There are people who wouldn't come if so and so came and people who would fight. It sucks.

I say do what your heart says. Your Father had 20 something years to turn his behavior around and make things right. He chose not to. I completely understand your guilt. I do the same thing, I take on the woes of the family and try to make it right. I say do whatever it takes to make that day a stress free and happy day for you and your fiance. Good Luck!


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## Dragonfly (Jul 12, 2007)

Boy this is a tough dilema. I was brought up in a dysfuctional household as well. The girls are all giving pretty good advice. And Canadian Gurl hit it on the head when she brought up the subject of guilt.

I suppose you could always email your father and let him know you will be getting maried next year. See how he reacts, feel him out.

If he does get invited, you need to be real clear about his behaviour and what you will tolerate. Are you capable of having a serious no bs talk with him - or would this be too intimidating?

Neither your mom nor your fiancee want your dad at the wedding. It is your day. Having been married, this is my advice: only invite those that you truly want to share this wonderful and special occasion. Everyone else can get a phone call after the fact.

Wish you luck honey with this difficult decision.


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## Solimar (Jul 12, 2007)

Thanks, ladies. I would email my father, but he is a liar and a very awkward 50 year old man. He tries so hard to be funny, like a teenager would, and doesn't understand that in some situations it is not welcome. I feel like I don't have a father, and would call him by his first name if I wasn't so utterly uncomfortable. Now that I think about it more, I know he does not miss me, or would really care to be present at any occasion of mine. He told me point blank that I was the reason his life was "miserable" and I know he dislikes me for whatever reason.

I wish I could be clear about his behavior, but he will not listen to anyone except his mommy and daddy. Maybe if I spoke to them, and they spoke to him, something would actually be done.

I just feel like such a bad daughter for openly disrespecting and disliking my own father so much!


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## Bexy (Jul 12, 2007)

Could you talk to him beforehand and let him know that there will be a zero tolerance policy with him at the wedding and if he feels he can not abide by that then maybe he should not come. At least that way you invite him and he knows that if he steps out of line even slightly he will have to leave.


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## luxotika (Jul 13, 2007)

What a tough situation to be in the middle of. I would say do what is best for YOU, and not worry about your father. There are no rules that say you have to get along with your parents. If not inviting him makes for a smoother wedding, so be it! Don't feel like you are a bad daughter, it is your special day.


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## Solimar (Jul 13, 2007)

I feel as though I am damned if I do and damned if I don't. I don't want to come across as a child who is acting up, but I also don't want to cause more problems by him not coming.

I am seriously thinking about having a civil ceremony and have that be it...no guests or anything, because this just sucks, haha.


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## pinkbundles (Jul 13, 2007)

It;s your wedding and if having him there will taint your day (regardless that he's your dad), then you shouldn't have him there. If he never cared for or stopped to notice you before, then why should you care if he misses your wedding?


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## Solimar (Jul 13, 2007)

I guess I always expect that at some point he will be different, and maybe he is just bad at showing his emotions. It has been nearly 10 years since he turned forty and freaked out...and you'd think that after a while you'd start to accept that you're going to die and try to live your life as best you can...and start giving a shit about the ones you try to convince everyone that you do.


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## Savvy_lover (Jul 13, 2007)

Do Not Invite Your Father Do Not Even Think About It Coz A Lot Of Miserable Ppl Will Try To Make Everyone Miserable!


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## emily_3383 (Jul 13, 2007)

omg dont invite either one! I sometimes think my family is nuts and i read some other peoples stories and i realized we are all nuts lol. Idk I really think you need to talk to your family like you said. This is alot more than just about a wedding its about resolving your past issues before you move on to marriage.


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## Shelley (Jul 13, 2007)

Originally Posted by *Sincerely Me* /img/forum/go_quote.gif Thanks, ladies. I would email my father, but he is a liar and a very awkward 50 year old man. He tries so hard to be funny, like a teenager would, and doesn't understand that in some situations it is not welcome. I feel like I don't have a father, and would call him by his first name if I wasn't so utterly uncomfortable. Now that I think about it more, I know he does not miss me, or would really care to be present at any occasion of mine. He told me point blank that I was the reason his life was "miserable" and I know he dislikes me for whatever reason. 
I wish I could be clear about his behavior, but he will not listen to anyone except his mommy and daddy. Maybe if I spoke to them, and they spoke to him, something would actually be done.

I just feel like such a bad daughter for openly disrespecting and disliking my own father so much!

I can relate to what you are saying. My parents told me I was never wanted, a mistake etc etc. And I also know what it is like to feel bad about disliking parents so much. Part of you wants them to accept you, you want a good relationship etc. Another part of you dislikes them for what they have done. I have been there many times and still experience troubles with this. Some people do change, but I have learned that many abusers do not change. They believe everyone else is to blame but themselves. I know how hard it is to believe this. I am just starting to see this for myself now. If someone says to me 'what are you parents like'? I often play up like they are nice, normal people when in fact (I hate to say this) they are not.

In regards to your wedding, I know this is a difficult situation for you. If it was my wedding day I know I wouldn't be able to relax, watching or worrying what my father may or may not do. Will he be on his best behavior, will he start to drink too much and cause a scene etc.

This is your special day and you don't need anyone potentially ruining it for you.


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## melpaganlibran (Jul 16, 2007)

toxic parents are toxic parents. if he treayts your mom like crap and shows up everywhere wasted, this may sound harsh but he may not deserve and invitation.


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## Kathy (Jul 16, 2007)

Originally Posted by *Sincerely Me* /img/forum/go_quote.gif Thanks, ladies. I would email my father, but he is a liar and a very awkward 50 year old man. He tries so hard to be funny, like a teenager would, and doesn't understand that in some situations it is not welcome. I feel like I don't have a father, and would call him by his first name if I wasn't so utterly uncomfortable. Now that I think about it more, I know he does not miss me, or would really care to be present at any occasion of mine. He told me point blank that I was the reason his life was "miserable" and I know he dislikes me for whatever reason. 
I wish I could be clear about his behavior, but he will not listen to anyone except his mommy and daddy. Maybe if I spoke to them, and they spoke to him, something would actually be done.

I just feel like such a bad daughter for openly disrespecting and disliking my own father so much!

If I were you, I wouldn't think twice about NOT inviting him to your wedding. Your wedding day is supposed to be the day when you are surrounded by friends and people who love you! It sounds like this man loves no one, probably not even himself! 
You have no reason to feel guilty. Please don't take offense, but that is your dysfunction talking. This may sound harsh, but just because you share his genes doesn't mean you have to share his BS. Alcohol and drugs do terrible things to people. (I know). And IF he does have a heart or really care, then maybe being removed from your life and your celebration of your future life would help him hit bottom. Which he needs to do if he's ever going to get his life together.

Hope things work out and you have a beautiful wedding day! Keep us posted!


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## jessimau (Jul 17, 2007)

Originally Posted by *Sincerely Me* /img/forum/go_quote.gif I just feel like such a bad daughter for openly disrespecting and disliking my own father so much! You are NOT the bad person here! Your father is the one who's openly disrespected you. You can choose to have him at your wedding and be on edge, worrying what he might do, or you can choose not to invite him and not worry about his doing something to screw up the day, but instead worry about what everyone is thinking about you. If people know you and know what your father's done, they'll be behind you and they won't judge you negatively for not having your father at the wedding. If they *will* judge you negatively for your father's absence, they don't deserve to be at your wedding.
Another thing. I know this is your father we're talking about, but PLEASE take your fiance's feelings into account as much as possible. It's not just your day, it's his day too, and you don't want to do something that would make him seriously uncomfortable, especially if it's only to keep up appearances. You are a good person and you've given your father enough of a chance to change. He's not changing anytime soon, so you have to decide if enough is enough or if you're still willing to put up with his nonsense. You are not to blame for any of this and you really should start treating yourself better. Putting yourself down by calling yourself a bad daughter is just continuing the negativity he taught you. When you catch yourself thinking that way, try to correct yourself with the truth -- that you're a good daughter who tried her hardest to have a good relationship, but whose father made choices that screwed up the relationship. You are worthy of having a drama-free wedding!






I'm sorry! I know that probably sounded harsh, but it's directed at him, not you. If it helps, try to look at the situation from the outside, from the perspective of what you'd tell a friend in this situation. You'll make the best decision, I'm sure!


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## Sheikah (Jul 17, 2007)

This is really tough and I know I'm not on your shoes, but don't feel guilty about not inviting him. You cannot take responsibility for other people's actions. Your act of not inviting him is a direct consequence of what he had done to you, it's his responsibility. You cannot take over your shoulders the burden of making everything right, it's just going to make you miserable. You want your wedding day to be as happy as it can possibly be, those days you share them with the people that love you and are going to be there to celebrate your happiness. I know that parents will always be important to us no matter what they do but, as Mel said, he just doesn't deserve to be there.


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## StrangerNMist (Jul 17, 2007)

Originally Posted by *kaville* /img/forum/go_quote.gif If I were you, I wouldn't think twice about NOT inviting him to your wedding. Your wedding day is supposed to be the day when you are surrounded by friends and people who love you! It sounds like this man loves no one, probably not even himself! 
You have no reason to feel guilty. Please don't take offense, but that is your dysfunction talking. This may sound harsh, but just because you share his genes doesn't mean you have to share his BS. Alcohol and drugs do terrible things to people. (I know). And IF he does have a heart or really care, then maybe being removed from your life and your celebration of your future life would help him hit bottom. Which he needs to do if he's ever going to get his life together.

Hope things work out and you have a beautiful wedding day! Keep us posted!

Very well said! =0]
Like Kaville said, this is your wedding and you're supposed to be around people that really, honestly love you. Given his past behavior and your discomfort with him, then I think it might be a good idea to forgo inviting him to the wedding.

Regardless, I want to congratulate you on your impending nuptials, and know that you and your future husband have a bright and beautiful future ahead of you =0]

*Bear Hugz*


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## styl1234 (Jul 18, 2007)

I don't think that you are a bad daughter. But in the end it is your day and you should be able to feel happy on your day and not having to look at your dad you hate so much.

I would not feel guilty as he has not shown any respect to either yourself or your mother, brother and feelings.

Have your day as you want it and enjoy. It is amazing how integer you have remained through all of this and hats of to you. This shows that you are a good person and you should be proud of yourself.


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## SqueeKee (Jul 18, 2007)

When I got married I didn't want my father there at all. He and my mom were together as teens until she got pregnant and gave him the boot for being a lazy bum. I've only seen him a handful of times in my life and his family has made no effort to be a part of my life.

I was pressured into inviting him, but he did not walk me down the aisle. I walked alone. When the official dances started, my husband danced with his mom, but I did not want to dance with my father at all. My step sister requested a song and kind of put me on the spot so that I HAD to dance with him, but I did not want to at all.

In the end, we got 300$ from him though, so it wasn't so bad.

But I still think he's an asshat.

Go with what your heart tells you, or you will regret it. You will only get this day once.


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## SierraWren (Jul 18, 2007)

Originally Posted by *Sincerely Me* /img/forum/go_quote.gif I feel as though I am damned if I do and damned if I don't. I don't want to come across as a child who is acting up, but I also don't want to cause more problems by him not coming. 
I am seriously thinking about having a civil ceremony and have that be it...no guests or anything, because this just sucks, haha.

But wouldn't it suck even more to let your father,in effect, steal this day from you, too (sounds like he has already unfairly taken so much of you, and still does)and have a civil ceremony if what you really want is a traditional wedding,the people you love all around you? After all, it is not only your "special day", it is your special and profoundly-worth protecting life that you are considering compromising from fear and guilt about what harm your father might potentially do to it. Do you fear that if, left uninvited, he might find out about your wedding anyway, and come to it and behave terribly, partly b/c that is how awful he is, partly as vengeance? B/c you sound as though you feel trapped--as if, even if you don't invite him, in some way, he'll make you pay for that, either by guilt tripping you,later(or by you putting yourself automatically through guilt over it)or by actually invading your life,physically, "acting up"(him, not you!)at another,later time. Like,whether or not you invite him, he'll wind up making you feel more like his hostage than a bride?First off: YOU are not the one acting up, or behaving childishly or or selfishly: you simply want to have peace and joy,without drama, on your wedding day, unthreatened by your father's juvenile,abusive and destructive behavior. I don't see at all how this would make you a "bad daughter," to desire no further exposure in your life to a father who has already harmed you so deeply, for so long.(It sounds,too,as if some part of you would also love to be able to get along with him and even forgive him, but that you recognize that,with his pathological irresponsibility and immaturity, this isn't likely to happen, at least not soon.That burden of "working things out" must be on his shoulders, not yours: trying to win back your trust. YOU are not even remotely responsible for the abuse he has inflicted on you, and any rage and hatred and mistrust you have for him are only natural responses to abuse--as well as,still, the desire that he show love for you too. You are a good,thoughtful daughter, of a man who does not know how to treasure your beauty and goodness--or anyone's. And this is what made and still makes him a bad father. For 20 years, you suffered with one--why start out the rest of your life with him overshadowing your fresh start,your new family?

I just don't believe he should be at your wedding;in fact,I think preventive measures should be taken if he somehow gets there.You have made attempts before to communicate with him, to try and express how you feel--and, again,repeatedly, these have failed;it sounds as if he refuses to take the emotions and concerns of other people seriously,and it is utterly impossible to deal with someone like that: you need to tell them "yes" and "no" and not waste your life on other words with them.Even so,if you want, you can write him a letter after the wedding, explaing the fears from past experiences(like graduation) which caused you to need to not invite him to your wedding.That way, maybe you'll feel less like you snubbed him--which is not at all your intention,after all. Your intention is to protect yourself and those around you,and you are even still thinking of his feelings too. In your perfect world,I think he would be mature and happy enough for you to be able to be there too.

I grew up in an abusive home too,and it has taken me many, many years to "resolve" my relationships with my parents, especially with my father. My mother is manic-depressive, and when I was growing up she was sick often enough that I was scared of what she'd do if I told her my father was physically abusing me(and one of my sisters)so though she knew, she "didn't"--there was really nowhere to go.Also,like you mentioned,I wondered often as a child what I could do to be "more lovable", or at least to get my father to hate me less than he did. I thought if I were only a little nicer to them..a better student...more helpful...more considerate...I would stop "causing" so much rage in them.That I could help "change" them.But,like your father, mine too had the kind of problems that had been around way, way before I'd been born.He blamed everyone for them but himself.It is impossible to help that sort of person.

Your fiance sounds extremely loving and protective of you, and as though he knows to steer your father, at this point, away from your life.And I think,on such a momentous day, to be surrounded by the people who love you purely is a wonderful thing--unless you truly prefer a civil ceremony,for other reasons, have the traditional wedding. It sounds like your paternal grandparents might be able to keep their son away from your wedding--do you think that could work?A friend of mine had Security at her wedding, not b/c of a parent but a violent ex she feared might show up--you might want to look into doing that to.

You have time to plan,but I want to tell you: I was married without either of my parents there.It was a civil ceremony b/c I have never been a "wedding" type, but for a moment I was sad, to have no father there to "give me away." But then I thought,"I was never his to give.Never."

I thought of all the times I couldn't lock the door on my father, so he just came in, and shook or hit me, and of this place, now,this little room,with just a few people around me and my groom:being with someone who I had chosen to love and be with and who loved me, who would help protect me, who I would try to protect, and I cherished every moment of it all--and I had never felt so happy,or safe,in my whole life.

You deserve that joy, and that safety, both--and more.And you can certainly have it.

sorry so long!!!!!!!!


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## ivette (Jul 19, 2007)

i grew up in a family where there was domestic violence. although i'm not married, and never had to deal with a situation like yours i can only tell you

how my sister handled it when she got married. she did not invite my father or his side of the family at all. my sister only felt obligated to send my dad a card informing him of her upcoming nuptials.

you should do whats best for you and your fiancee. don't let anybody bully

you into doing something you don't feel comfortable with. remember, its you

and your fiancee's special day.

hope this helps. good luck with whatever you both decide


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## Solimar (Jul 20, 2007)

I think I am just going to end up telling him after the fact, that way I don't feel so bad, and I also avoid all of his BS. What is really comes down to is that I don't want him there or involved in any aspect of my life, and I'd love to keep it that way.

Thanks for all of your support, you made this much easier for me.


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