# 40 Reasons Not To Have Children



## Dragonfly (Sep 19, 2009)

*Need an excuse not to have kids? Here are 40*

For any woman who has doubts about motherhood, a new book offers a number of reasons, 40 in fact, to lock up her womb and throw away the key. "No Kids: 40 Reasons Not to Have Children," caused a huge uproar when it was published in Europe in French in 2007, largely because the author openly stated that she regrets having children.

In the book, Corinne Maier -- a mother of two -- explains that she came to the realization after a disastrous family trip to a museum that ended in temper tantrums.

"Sometimes I regret having children," Maier explained earlier this week during an interview on Canada AM. "Not every day, but sometimes when my children are mischievous or when they annoy me too much. And yes, I thought it would be fun to write a tongue-in-cheek book about children because nobody explores the shortcomings of having children. We are supposed to be so delighted when you have children."

Each of the 40 reasons Maier gives to remain childless gets a chapter in the book.

Titles such as, "Child, the killer of desire," and, "They will destroy your time and your freedom," shocked readers in France, where the state financially rewards women for having kids.

Maier argues generous maternity-leave benefits and cash payments for having more children prevent women from being successful outside the home.

But she also says her book was meant to be a humourous look at the bad days all families have, when mothers wish they were anywhere but in the kitchen, wiping baby food off the walls.

"Those days when sometimes you say, 'I'd like to have another life,'" she said.

According to Maier, her book is designed to break through the myths that motherhood alone gives meaning to a woman's life. It is also a warning to consider how dramatically one's life will change after having kids.

"I think it's important to consider our desires first and then to think about the future," she said.

It's hard to predict how readers will respond to the book in North America, where celebrity "bump watches" are a hallmark of Hollywood reporting and Bugaboo strollers match cars and homes as status symbols.

Maier expects a divided verdict, much like in Europe.

"Some people are shocked, some people love it and understand that it's a book made to laugh about ourselves and to show the conventional parents in a kind of mirror," she said.

But most importantly, what do her children think of the book? Maier said she has explained to her kids that she wasn't criticizing them directly or insinuating that she doesn't love them.

"I think they've understood that there was nothing bad in it," Maier said. "And my daughter has read it recently and she told me, 'Yes, it's fun, I think it's a good idea to write a book on such an issue.'"

Source: CTV.ca | Need an excuse not to have kids? Here are 40


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## emily_3383 (Sep 19, 2009)

That book wont go well in this country. lol I started watching this kid afterschool and after this experience I know I dont want any. lol


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## internetchick (Sep 19, 2009)

Motherhood isn't always fun. Nothing wrong with talking about it in a humorous way. I love my kids, but hell yeah I have days when I think WTF did I get myself into?


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## emily_3383 (Sep 19, 2009)

I think some people take it too seriously. Ive heard people call this lady a monster. Atleast shes being honest.


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## mollydolly (Sep 20, 2009)

i'm afraid to have children

i might just hate them

haaa

when people ask me to hold babies... i'm just like.. uhh ok but why?

i don't like it.


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## Dalylah (Sep 20, 2009)

I have 4. Some days I wake up to the most amazing miracles you can imagine... the smiles, the love, the wonder that is inside of them. Some days I wake up and it's like a mud wrestling pit in hell...screaming, stuff flying around, squabbling... well you know the drill. My best advice is if you aren't sure then wait.


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## Chaeli (Sep 20, 2009)

I made my bed before I laid down in it. I only have myself to thank or to blame for all my own decisions that were a result of my decision making. I love my children and I have no regrets. I realised the sacrifices before I made my own decisions.


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## pinksugar (Sep 20, 2009)

interesting sounding book. I don't think there's anything wrong with discussing this issue in a humorous way either.

I love babies, but just like puppies and kittens, they grow up! I know that right now I most definitely don't want children.

It's difficult, I think if I didn't have them at some point in my life, I'd always wonder what I'd missed out on, but if I did, I'd definitely have those days where they annoyed the hell out of me!

I think the idea that children are precious and a joy and such is partially true, sure, but the fact remains that they are also a lot of hard work and mess and screaming. Nothing wrong with mentioning that, LOL


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## Andi (Sep 20, 2009)

how funny! I donÂ´t think my mom ever regretted having kids because sheÂ´s not the type of person to have a life of her own anyway (yup that sounds bad but itÂ´s the truth), and I was a perfect little angle as a kid. Now my brother was very stubborn and egoistic, I bet that wasnÂ´t always easy to deal with.

Geez, people who call that woman a monster obviously have no sense of humor...or their kids are perfect little angels who never even had the slightest negative influence on their mommyÂ´s sex life/ personal life/career.


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## pinksugar (Sep 20, 2009)

well she claims her kids have read it and support her decision to write it, so clearly they weren't too hurt by it.

My mum has said many times that she never wanted to have children but that she's glad (in some ways) that she did. Never hurt me a bit - regretting your decision is not the same as being a terrible, neglectful parent IMO


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## Chaeli (Sep 20, 2009)

Originally Posted by *pinksugar* /img/forum/go_quote.gif well she claims her kids have read it and support her decision to write it, so clearly they weren't too hurt by it.
My mum has said many times that she never wanted to have children but that she's glad (in some ways) that she did. Never hurt me a bit - regretting your decision is not the same as being a terrible, neglectful parent IMO

I do agree with your mom. We all have those feelings. However to tell your kids they have destroyed your life, desires and freedoms is another thing. Especially when they hear it throughout their lives. Two of my childhood friends killed themselves because of it.


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## pinksugar (Sep 20, 2009)

I agree, there is definitely a difference between telling your kids that they destroyed your life etc, and telling them that they had never planned on having kids or regretted it in some small way.

It's a big step from joking about the bad parts about having kids, and being a neglectful, verbally abusive parent. Who knows which side of the line this woman actually comes down on? she might be a top mum, she might be awful


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## Adrienne (Sep 20, 2009)

I don't see anything wrong with her book. Just because she regrets her children doesn't mean she doesn't love them. With every big decision in life that one makes, no matter how good they are, there will be regrets. I sometimes regret my child when I wonder what I could've been doing instead. BUT it's more of a feeling of when I'm frustrated and in no way would I change the past even if I could. I highly doubt she would actually take it all back if she could.

Moms, even with more wild things going on, are stygmitized whenever we complain about motherhood. Moms are supposed to be 100% selfless 100% of the time and completely perfect in rearing our children. If we make a mistake, we're ragged for it. One time, I went to get my haircut and my mother in law was watching my child. She was not paying attention and my son got his hand burned on the stove. The first thing the rest of in laws did was give that look that said "Where were you? Too busy taking care of yourself instead of your son..." I'm glad she wrote this book. There are moms out there who feel like they can't voice these feelings due to others claiming they're not motherly for it and this book shows those women that you can look at it in a humorous way.

I'm human and just like every other person on this earth, my patience has a limit, I have my faults, and I don't stop having feelings just because I'm a mom. But my child has all the love he needs and I still do everything I have to do for him (even if sometimes I'd rather not share that last cupcake lol.)


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## pinksugar (Sep 21, 2009)

thanks adrienne. You put exactly how I feel into words.

And btw, you are an awesome mum!


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## reesesilverstar (Sep 21, 2009)

I don't see anything wrong with the book either. Every mother who's honest would admit that sometimes it could be overwhelming and for a second you do go there. But you love and sacrifice still for your children. If you could get a good laugh out of it, then why not?


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## emily_3383 (Sep 21, 2009)

Originally Posted by *Adrienne* /img/forum/go_quote.gif I don't see anything wrong with her book. Just because she regrets her children doesn't mean she doesn't love them. With every big decision in life that one makes, no matter how good they are, there will be regrets. I sometimes regret my child when I wonder what I could've been doing instead. BUT it's more of a feeling of when I'm frustrated and in no way would I change the past even if I could. I highly doubt she would actually take it all back if she could. 
Moms, even with more wild things going on, are stygmitized whenever we complain about motherhood. Moms are supposed to be 100% selfless 100% of the time and completely perfect in rearing our children. If we make a mistake, we're ragged for it. One time, I went to get my haircut and my mother in law was watching my child. She was not paying attention and my son got his hand burned on the stove. The first thing the rest of in laws did was give that look that said "Where were you? Too busy taking care of yourself instead of your son..." I'm glad she wrote this book. There are moms out there who feel like they can't voice these feelings due to others claiming they're not motherly for it and this book shows those women that you can look at it in a humorous way.

I'm human and just like every other person on this earth, my patience has a limit, I have my faults, and I don't stop having feelings just because I'm a mom. But my child has all the love he needs and I still do everything I have to do for him (even if sometimes I'd rather not share that last cupcake lol.)

This was very well said! Sometimes I feel like women are so harsh on each other and for someone to say "Hey, sometimes im tired of my kids" doesnt mean they are a bad person it means they are human. Of course some parents can be cruel to their kids but in this case I think shes just being honest.


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## Aprill (Sep 21, 2009)

I just ordered this book to see what all the fuss was about. SHE DIDNT SAY ANYTHING WRONG. I have 4 children (and one on the way shut your mouth dont ask) and I regret them in a way. I wish to shake the hand of the woman that dances around all day in sheer excitement because she has children. Here are some reasons she gave in her book:

You will lose touch with your friends

â€¢Your sex life will be over

â€¢Children cost a fortune

â€¢Child-rearing is endless drudgery

â€¢Vacations will be nightmares

â€¢Youâ€™ll lose your identity and become just â€œmomâ€ or â€œdadâ€

â€¢Your children will become mindless drones of capitalism

â€¢The planetâ€™s already overcrowded

â€¢Your children will inevitably disappoint you

For me personally, I have no friends because of my kids and the fact that it is hard to find someone to befriend because most ladies have one or no children and they have 'freebird lives'. My sex life is over for the most part, that's been cut down to like once a week because we dont do it when they are at home at all (too many people running around). Children are expensive, vacations are horrible, I have lost my identity, someone will call my name and I dont answer because I am used to being called mom. Hell, my mom calls me mom. I dont get to do the things that i used to do; as a matter of fact I never got to do anything anyway because I had a child at 16. So the things that juniors and seniors got to do I didnt because I had a child and my mom didnt go for the ole okie doke throw him off on me BS. You made it. you take care of it. College was harder, graduating was harder. But I'm stronger because of all this, and I can guide anyone in the right path cause I took it.

But my kids are here. By the grace of God they arent going anywhere anytime soon, the good reasons why to have kids outweigh the bad. I can name 100 reasons to have a child. I enjoy the crazy stuff that they do. I couldnt imagine my life without them.

The ladies that call her a monster are those hypocrites that dont wanna openly admit that parenting is a tiring business. Or they have nannies


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## Dumac (Sep 26, 2009)

Most of the things listed in that book are probably true and mostly well known, but considered ill mannered to say or point out.

Society puts a lot of pressure on women to have kids, despite overpopulation becoming an increasing threat to sustained, comfortable human living. Both women and men, but especially women, are considered abnormal if they decide not to have children and are often subject to much scrutiny.

I can only recommend having children to those that a ready to take the plunge and commit themselves to it. It is a lot of work, but nothing on this Earth compares, in both effort and satisfaction, of rearing a child.


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## creolesugar (Sep 27, 2009)

I never wanted kids, so this will probably end up in my library


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## Andi (Sep 27, 2009)

hmmmm IÂ´m wondering if I really want kids (if my fiancÃ© reads this I`ll be in trouble lol)

I hope I`m ok if I have kids at 30 or even a bit older, that way IÂ´ll have had a bit of a life beforehand


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## Chaeli (Sep 27, 2009)

Originally Posted by *Andi* /img/forum/go_quote.gif hmmmm IÂ´m wondering if I really want kids (if my fiancÃ© reads this I`ll be in trouble lol)I hope I`m ok if I have kids at 30 or even a bit older, that way IÂ´ll have had a bit of a life beforehand

That is what planned parenthood is all about. Many of the bitter people were not ready and most had no idea, even after being warned, of the sacrifices they would be making. If I had the chance to start over I would also have waited until in my thirties when I actually had a clue as to what I really wanted in life. Take your time and enjoy life before making the decision of whether or not to have children in your life.


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## Karren (Sep 27, 2009)

I wanted a hampster but Noooooo.... my wife wanted kids!!! lol Still love them no mater how much of a pain in the ass they are!!


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## Aprill (Sep 27, 2009)

Shit, I got a hamster I regret buying....


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## lynne956 (Sep 28, 2009)

I'm so glad to have ran over this thread (so compelled I registered (!) and what a blessing that it happened today when it seems like it all hit the fan!) and even had a good laugh at some of the replies -- thanks moms! Some days, becoming a mother was nothing like what the world paints it to be or what the books ever prepare you for; let alone what society expects from you. But then there ARE those days when you really see why they are the amazing people they are and all those instances of crazies are instantly non-existent in that moment. Like watching my 3-yo tuck in my 2-yo to bed and giving him hugs and kisses while they're both giggling and smiling is definitely heartwarming. And this is coming from the *same* 3-yo who decided it was easier to take toys from the 2-yo instead of asking or getting poked in the face when the 2-yo decided to stake his ground... hi, major toddler battle.

Having kids that close was definitely an ambitious move on Hubbs and I, and although each day is never a dull moment for any parent, my goal like most, is to try harder each day to make progression on the previous. What mother doesn't at least try? I'm not perfect, and like Adrienne said, patience has it's limits. I had to call one of my mom friends one time because one day I lost it and I felt so bad for literally screaming at the top of my lungs at my kids. To find out that I wasn't the only mother that did that, was the most incredible thing I could have heard at that moment because I felt like a failure by having to result to such voice levels. And she reassured me that I didn't do it because I was a bad mother (because that's how I felt), but I had been pushed to my limits. And yes, we all have them.

But despite the experiences that make motherhood "motherhood", I love my joys and express this to them daily even though it may not seem like it when I'm screaming sternly giving loving words of discipline during the most trying of times. But I too am only human and I think us mothers need more recognition for that than we're given.

I haven't read the book, but I can appreciate someone who is being human about the experience. Being real about it, doesn't mean that a mother is unappreciative or unloving, nor does it make her a negligible mother. Having a bit of humor about it doesn't hurt anyone unless they are truly intentionally trying to be cruel towards the individual. But in anything, there will always be those more sensitive to such material. Life changes with each decision made, and at the end of the day, God chose me to be the mother in their lives.

Sorry for the longwinded post, but thanks in advance for letting me share. Keep up the good work moms




You're doing great!


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## MakeupByMe (Sep 29, 2009)

I Totally agree with Andi. April &amp; Adrien (Hey all A's lol) ANYWAYS lol I loooooove my kids &amp; They Drive me crazzzzzzzzzzy Like My goodness lock me in the mental ward now lol Just playin but at times it feels that hard &amp; Being a single Mom of 2 babies is hard &amp; Stressful &amp; Draining BUT I wouldnt Change it for anything in the world!!! Like April Said theres so much more good reasons than there is bad!!

Alot of ppl THINK that woman who feel some regret should not have had children &amp; Should have thought real Hard about the pros &amp; cons of Motherhood! BUT The truth is no matter how many Mothers you talk to or how many motherhood books you read There NEVER gona have the EXACT feelings that you will you'll never know untill you yourself are a mother!!

And Lets keep it real here to all the mothers who who Say this woman is wrong &amp; that there the happiest most loving most patient mother with no slightest regret &amp; Who never had a "What If" thought.................PLease.................Giv e me some of what your on!


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## bella1342 (Sep 29, 2009)

Hi lynne! Welcome to MUT!!


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## Chaeli (Sep 29, 2009)

I think the point isn't whether moms and dads feel these same thoughts and feel the same feelings because we all do. I have nine children so I really don't need any advice at this point as I have been through it all time and time again. My youngest is six years old. My oldest is thirty. Regardless of how I have ever felt, I have never told any of my children they destroyed my life, robbed me of anything or said anything to make them feel they should never have been born. I never will and have a very low opinion of parents that use these daggers even in anger with their children. I'm not sure about the laws here in California, but I do know from the state I moved here from that if you are caught talking to your children in that manner, the state can and does step in and do remove the children from the homes for mental abuse as well they should. For those who would say there is no proof that this woman has ever done that, well the proof is in her own words in her own book.


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## Turboweevel (Oct 7, 2009)

Yeah, Snoofard, because the second a woman pops out a kid she immediately stops being a human being with feelings and wants of her own. No, she becomes just a walking robot whose only purpose in life is to cater to the kids' every whim. God forbid she wants something for herself for a change, even if it's a night of intimacy with her life partner, without having to worry about a kid barging in just because. God forbid she wishes she could have greater financial solidity rather than living paycheck to paycheck because her having children turned out to be immensely expensive. And most of all, God forbid she wants to have a moment free of worrying if the kids are ok, if Billy isn't climbing trees again or if Jenny is getting bullied. Nope, motherhood is an immediate resignation of everything and the absolute reduction to the role of "provider".

I see far more selfishness in you for denying a woman her right to want the things that made her life nice than her wanting those things in the first place.

And honestly, I hope this book brings perspective to all the 16-year-olds who want to have children they can't support financially or emotionally. Having kids is tough and this book puts it all in bullet points and she is not a wretch for writing it. Not everyone has the emotional oomph for children and those people have no business having children. And if this book helps them realize that having kids isn't the same thing as living in a sitcom then she is everything but a wretch.

Get off your high horse before it trips and you crack your neck.


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## Darla (Oct 7, 2009)

Not wanting to have children is not about narcissism at all. People choose to NOT have children for a variety of reasons and it is completely wrong of someone especially someone who does not know a couple to suggest their life is not complete without children.

I find it amazing that someone who has no knowledge of this couple can pass judgment on them and call them selfish.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Originally Posted by *creolesugar* /img/forum/go_quote.gif I never wanted kids, so this will probably end up in my library



what amazing honesty.


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## Turboweevel (Oct 7, 2009)

Originally Posted by *Snoofard* /img/forum/go_quote.gif i quite love my high horse,if you were worthy i'd let you ride my horse.i will not tolerate verbal abuse by a bunch of ingrates.

The BIACH has spoken

Right, because it's a-ok for you to verbally abuse someone who isn't even here to defend herself, by calling her a wretch and making all sorts of accusations about how she's killing her childrens' emotional life, etc etc, but now that the shoe is on the other foot you react by replying in all caps in a huge font size, basically throwing a tantrum and stomping your feet. Maybe you should just leave, 12 year olds aren't allowed on US based internet forums.


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## Andi (Oct 7, 2009)

Originally Posted by *Darla* /img/forum/go_quote.gif Not wanting to have children is not about narcissism at all. People choose to NOT have children for a variety of reasons and it is completely wrong of someone especially someone who does not know a couple to suggest their life is not complete without children. 
I find it amazing that someone who has no knowledge of this couple can pass judgment on them and call them selfish.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I agree. There is nothing wrong with chosing to not have children. Also I see nothing wrong with mothers who sometimes imagine what their life would be without them. And thereÂ´s also nothing wrong with admitting the truth, the fact that there are pros and cons to having children, although there are mothers who definitely donÂ´t think there are any cons about this. 
The only thing that is obviously wrong is telling your kids that you truly wish they hadnÂ´t been born.

Why do mothers feel the need to bash other mothers when it comes to kids?


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## Turboweevel (Oct 7, 2009)

Originally Posted by *Andi* /img/forum/go_quote.gif I agree. There is nothing wrong with chosing to not have children. Also I see nothing wrong with mothers who sometimes imagine what their life would be without them. And thereÂ´s also nothing wrong with admitting the truth, the fact that there are pros and cons to having children, although there are mothers who definitely donÂ´t think there are any cons about this. 
The only thing that is obviously wrong is telling your kids that you truly wish they hadnÂ´t been born.

Why do mothers feel the need to bash other mothers when it comes to kids?

Because they all think they are the best mommies in the whole wide world so anyone who does anything differently or feels different things is automatically a horrible horrible person who is not worthy of life and should have her kids taken away from her promptly.
Protip: You're human and therefore you are just as prone too error as any other human out there. Nobody is the sole owner of the truth and what works for you might not work for someone else. Different strokes for different folks, people.


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## Aprill (Oct 7, 2009)

1.Snoofard: post edited take it as a warning, that's a form of screaming here and homie (ie. ME) dont play that. We can have intelligent conversation here without all the this and that. Yes I saw the high horse comment but as an adult you dont have to entertain it. If I entertained every negative comment made about me here...nevermind.

2. The regret of having children is not narcissism at all! You have children I imagine, so let me be mature and first off give you props for having the 'perfect parenting experience' because I am not.

The regret of having children comes from missing things, even basic necessaties that everyone wants. *sigh* so let ME keep it real here if no one else will:

I am not able to take a bath or shower whenever I want, I have to wait on this one and that one to be sleep first, or for my husband to get off work, or for my mother to come over because they can raise the roof in this MF for 10 minutes. narcissism? no...I just wanna wash my ass.

My bed.is.full. I have myself, my husband, my 9 month old and a 3 year old in a king size bed. I would like to lay next to my husband but I cant cause we have preverbial wooden planks separating us in the bed....narcissism? No. I wanna be spooned damnit! (lol)

I havent had 8 hours of sleep since labor day....narcissism? no...but 3 hours a sleep a day for a pregnant woman sucks but a ***** like myself gonna keep it moving.

When the kids are sick, or one of my kids is hurt and I feel helpless, and just wanna cry and say to myself, "I wish I never had you because I dont want you to suffer" (your children ever been tested for mengitis? the little torture chamber they put babies in for an x-ray..vaccinations, a baby with the flu, my 3 year old vomiting, all 4 of mine have had swine flu, I can go on and on and on) narcissism? HELL NO...it makes me regret them because they are suffering....and I like the ball to be in my hands and I am powerless in that moment.

I dont complain about not being able to play in makeup, and going to clubs (never did that), and drinking (dont care for it) and smoking, and all of that. The changes that have happened in my life concerning my children have all been for the better. I dont know of anything in my life that had no trials and tribulations that made my life easy. That's not what life is...life is challenges, learning experiences, the ability to smile and still sing if you are a caged bird. Knowing that in the end, everything is going to be great.

Now let me address this DHS coming to get children cause mommy said baby was a mistake...*side eye* Tell me what state so I can do what i do and put an end to it. Cause that state, like many other states, dont have enough money to entertain such foolishness. And anyone who calls on a parent because of something like that needs to burn.in.hell. And you would agree with taking a child out of a home, putting them in foster care, to be potentially ABUSED FOR REAL, starved, beat, raped, molested, scar this child forever, because mommy said 'i didnt want to have you'? Are you freaking kidding me! I was a single parent at the time, my soon to be husband in Kuwait, I'm holding it down at home, I pay a broad who was supposed to be my best friend to watch my 5 MONTH OLD CHILD, she breaks her arm, I was no where around, I was investigated, they found that she was liable, she kept her kids, not a day in jail...and youre telling me if I tell one of these that came out of my vajayjay that I really didnt want them...the state gonna come and pack it up! 'Cuse me while i take a giggle.


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## Andi (Oct 7, 2009)

Bravo, April! Never have I read so much honesty about being a mother. And at the same time you scared me a bit lol.


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## Aprill (Oct 7, 2009)

Thanks hun. I wish more mothers would keep in breezy up in here! And I can go on and on and on.......


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## baddeschik (Oct 7, 2009)

snoofard you wanna get off that high horse that you cant even get on or shall i knock you off?

ROODIES BACK IN THIS ISHHH! &gt;=P


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## pinksugar (Oct 7, 2009)

lol Aprill, such an epic post. I enjoyed reading every word of it, and agree 100%


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## Turboweevel (Oct 7, 2009)

Originally Posted by *Snoofard* /img/forum/go_quote.gif *I am a successful hard working woman with 2 college degrees.I am a feminist just like my Mother raised me to be.I have been on City counsel,Worked for the Mayor when I was in my 20's and have had a full life along with my child,You have no clue what I went through to have a child,my first child died due to extreme prematurity from me not having a cervix*.I had surgery called a Trans abdominal Uterine Cerclage* I was on bed rest and steroids to keep me from going into preterm labor I was 25 years old and had been married for years.My Doctor put in my medical report that I will post on here, that in the 30 years he'd been an OBGYN he'd never seen a woman who wanted a child as badly as I and my husband.I went through hell and back,I saw 8 Doctors that told me I would never ever bear a child.I found this Doctor and paid a lot of money to get all this done.I don't have to live pay check to pay check.That's why I went to College for 6 years!When my child was born ,my Home was paid for and we had no depts whatsoever.I married well, which is hard for most women to do.I don't have to explain myself to anyone at all . I love me!So when I hear somebody complaining because they can't stand the fact they had children I have no sympathy, keep your legs together or they make such things as birth control and will freely sterilize you if you have the money.* Many have tried to "knock me off my high horse" but I just ran over them ,straight to the top where I will dwell forever.

I will not speak again as I have more then made my point

That's lovely, Snoofard, pity your tragic story and your two degrees didn't teach you that telling someone to mind their manners and calling them a "f-word-ing c-word-related-to-female-genitalia" in the same sentence, like the pearl of wisdom of a PM you sent me, is the definition of hypocrisy. It seems it also didn't teach you that you really shouldn't make assumption about how a mother feels towards her children simply because she is using a book to detail and explain the opportunity costs of having children (you have two degrees, I'm sure you can work out what "opportunity cost" means). Thirdly, it seems to have given you this surprising idea that people are all knowing and perfectly rational all the time. While that works fine in economic theory it clashes with reality like wearing lime green shoes with a burgundy dress. Not everyone has kids by mistake. It's not about keeping it in your pants. Many people think "Oh hey, I should have a kid!" simply because they think it's a good idea when it isn't, or because their parents are all up their keister about it. Hell, my mom wants me to have kids yesterday, and I don't think I'll be up for having them for at least another decade. A lot of people also underestimate the financial costs involved (I mean, come on, so many people have trouble with something as simple as the concept of "credit". They can't really do an accurate financial breakdown of the costs of child rearing). Sometimes all it is is a Bad Decision .
And just because you wanted children oh so badly doesn't mean everyone else should want them too. My mother went through hell to get me, going through fertility treatments and serial miscarriages before finally carrying to term at the ripe old age of 41. She also married well, we're very solid financially. How is this relevant? It isn't. And neither is your medical history. Just because fate took a dump on you and made it very difficult for you to bear children doesn't give you the right to pass judgement on other people's feelings and decisions towards having children. And it doesn't give you the right to be abrasive towards them, especially behind their backs.

Honestly, the only place you rode your high horse was down a flight of stairs. And you hit your head on the wall in the bottom.

But glad to see your language has improved, at least you realised that calling other people "f-word-ing c-word-related-to-female-genitalia" and proclaiming yourself a "b-word about female dogs" (an accurate description though not one to be proud of) don't set a good example.


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## baddeschik (Oct 7, 2009)

Turboweevel well put! &lt;3

ppl like Snoofard are going through hell and heaven to have a kid to keep their man HAHA trying to create this perfect family home that doesn't exist, trying to make up for what they lack. Snoofard, get a life sweetie,because this fake one you're trying to create in your head doesn't exist, you might get a cervix with it too ;] im heartless towards ignorants like yourself, pity trailer park trash.


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## Turboweevel (Oct 7, 2009)

Originally Posted by *baddeschik* /img/forum/go_quote.gif Turboweevel well put! &lt;3 Thanks :3 I just hate this sort of Holier-than-Thou sorts who think they are the standard by which humanity should be measured.


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## baddeschik (Oct 7, 2009)

couldnt agree w/ you more


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## Aprill (Oct 7, 2009)

Okies lets be nice from now on. I spoke to whom I needed to speak to about the language, and we are going to stick to the topic without calling names and such. I love the discussion that we are having but I as well have two going on three college degrees, so lets be adults here



. Lets be nice or imma get on you tube and start sining kumbaya...and you dont want that.


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## baddeschik (Oct 7, 2009)

lmao aprill you know id love that!


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## Aprill (Oct 7, 2009)

I cant sing. you dont want me singing in your life...


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## baddeschik (Oct 7, 2009)

lmao youre the best&lt;3 can i get it as a ringtone???


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## Aprill (Oct 7, 2009)

Yup, for a MAC thermal mask


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## pinksugar (Oct 7, 2009)

haha you kids are funny.

Yup, Aprill is right, it's a really interesting topic, and no one wants her singing kumbaya, so thanks for doing your best to keep it polite from here on in!


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## Darla (Oct 7, 2009)

This has been an interesting discussion (for the most part). No one really needed to drag out their parenting credentials to weigh in on this one. People can say what they want without it getting personal necessarily. I still find it amazing that this is the type of issue that is personal and private yet many in society think they can dictate what is right or wrong. There are couples that cannot have children or recognize they may not make great parents so would rather not.

It is always an uncomfortable answer when someone feels like they have the right to ask someone something like that. At the very least the book provides some snappy comebacks to those that ask.

Nice post Carolyn.


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## bCreative (Oct 7, 2009)

I'm on another forum and the topic of not wanting children is selfish and wrong always seems to pop up.

I for one don't see anything wrong with a woman not wanting kids. Why some people see it as stupid or selfish is beyond me! I know right now that I don't want any children, I think the whole pregnancy thing and pushing a child out of my vajayjay really freaks me out.


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## Darla (Oct 8, 2009)

I was thinking about this question from another perspective. If you go back even a few decades a good portion of the population at least in the US and Canada was engaged in farming. Big families were the norm and were desired for the primary reason that the farmer would have plenty of labor around to help out on the farm. Now there was a real reason for having kids -- free labor!

I found census information that bears this out. In 1890 it was 4.93 persons per household. In 2002 that figure was 2.58.

Now the idea of having children is more the notion of having descendants than anything else. There's no doubt that couples are having less children than in decades past and probably more couples will decide (for whatever reason) that they don't wish to have them. Notice that is still a matter of choice, in some places notably China family size is limited to maybe one child and i find it deplorable that some people may terminate a birth based on the sex of a child.

Interesting enough over the past 30 years while the number of people per household has decreased 25 % the size of the average home has increased in size almost 50 %.


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## Dragonfly (Oct 8, 2009)

Don't forget the lack of birth control back then - I wonder how many parents had children they really wanted.

Personally, I think it is courageous for a parent to say that their kid drives them crazy or that they might have had regrets. These are very human feelings that the parent is absolutely entitled to.

Glad I started this thread - I love a spirited discussion!


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## danicruz3684 (Oct 10, 2009)

i love my daughter emily!


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## bella1342 (Oct 11, 2009)

Thanks for keeping this thread in line Aprill!


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## TwinkletOes26 (Oct 16, 2009)

I am 27 and I steeeeel dont hear my bio clock ticking some may think im nuts but i dont want kids until im like 34 or 35 (yes i prepared to shell out money for fertility treatments). I mean now we have methods that will prevent you from having a baby until you are good and ready to.

I dont see whats so wrong with a mother saying her kids drive her nuts i mean how many of us have said we love our parents but they drive us batty? Why is it ok for a teen to say it about his.her mom but if the mom says the same its horrid? I dont understand it.


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