# Anyone know if you can rebuild collagen in skin



## charish (Jan 12, 2007)

i was wondering if you could rebuild collagen in your face w/o any procedure or if any of you knew of the best and more permanent procedure.


----------



## sheil2009 (Jan 12, 2007)

ahhh...i doubt it. Products may claim to do so, but it is VERY sketchy and I would not spend tons of money on these products


----------



## SimplyElegant (Jan 12, 2007)

I'm pretty sure you can't.


----------



## Dragonfly (Jan 12, 2007)

Tretinoin has been clinically proven to improve collagen production. It is the active ingredient in Retin A or Renova in the US and Stievaa Vitamin A acid gel, in Canada.

Quoting for Paula Begoun, "Tretinoin helps to improvement of skin's healthy cell production, collagen production, elasticity, texture, and dermal thickness."

You can read more in her website cosmeticscop.com


----------



## charish (Jan 12, 2007)

wow, if that's true, do you know where i can purchase it at?

oh, nevermind. i just read about it and it has some bad affects and it said it won't go away until the treatment is stopped. but thanks anyway everyone, i guess i'll just have to go and find someone to do something for me.


----------



## Dragonfly (Jan 12, 2007)

In Canada, a doctor has to write a prescription for Stievaa Vit A acid gel.

A family doctor can write the prescription - no need to see a dermatologist.

I am sure that you need a prescription in the US for Renova or Retin A.

A tube lasts for 6 months and costs $30. I have been using it since my mid 20s and I'm 43 now.

General info:

Start at a low strength dosage 0.01 and work up to higher strengths.

Use only a pea size amount and apply to entire face including under eyes. But not eyelids.

Wait at least 15 min after washing face before applying. Ok to apply makeup after applying.

To get use to it at the begining, apply every other day or every 3 days.

Ask pharmacist if it is ok to use moisturizers with it - they might decrease it's strength.

You will need to use spf as your skin will become really sensitive to the sun.

Do not by products over the counter that claim to have retinol or similar. They do not contain Tetrinoin as it is a prescription. These products probably cost more that Retin A and do no more for your skin that cold cream.

What bad side affects does it say? I have heard that some find it irritating.

If you apply it the way I recommend, the irritating goess away pretty quick - and it is very tolerable.


----------



## FeverDream (Jan 12, 2007)

I've recently been doing research to devise an anti-aging regemin for myself, and here are just random excerpts from my notes where collagen is mentioned.

------------------------

Vitamin C: Potent antioxidant, noted for protecting skin cells from sun damage, low risk of skin irritation at concentrations of 10% or lower, strengthens skinâ€™s barrier and minimizes water loss, encourages collagen production, thereby thickening the skinâ€™s dermal layer, reduces inflammation, lightens hyperpigmentation

Amino Acid Peptides: Helps with collagen and elastic producing cells (fibroblasts) becoming less abundant. They start lazy fibroblasts and encourage new ones to return to the aging dermis.

- Work better when combined with antioxidants such as white tea, pomegranate and grape seed extracts plus components essential to restore the ceramide barrier lost as our skin ages. They work together to stimulate dermal fibroblasts to rebuild collagen and elastin fibers

- Treatments are more powerful than AHA treatments, produce more dramatic results, and are not as photosensitizing to the skin, and result in less irritation. Amino acid treatments act by attaching to skin cells to fill in lines and make skin appear smoother, in addition to improving skin tone and color, providing exfoliation, reducing fine lines and wrinkles, and minimizing the appearance of photodamage

- Palmitoyl pentapeptide-3 â€“ instructs the body to make more collagen wherever the cream is applied (DDF Cellular Revitalization Age Renewal Cream)

Copper Peptides: Stimulates collagen formation, diminishing fine lines and firming the skin ; stimulates elastin formation, cutting down on sagging and fine lines ; stimulates the formation of the extracellular cement between cells, thus improving skin strength, cutting down on fragility ; Stimulates the formation of GAGS (glycosaminoglycans). This helps to thicken the dermis resulting in a lessening of sagging and helps firm the skin ; Increases blood vessel formation and oxygenation within the skin ; Acts as a potent antioxidant by stimulating the enzymatic function of Superoxide Dismutase.

- Use products like Glycolic Acids and/or vitamin A products to thin the epidermal layer, use products with vitamin C and copper peptides on alternate mornings to stimulate fibroblast activity which results in collagen formation and other important dermal elements. Don't use Vitamin C at the same time as copper products.

- Vitamin A helps with collagen formation in addition to its exfoliating functions, copper peptides act both as an antioxidant to help prevent aging skin changes while helping stimulate collagen and elastin formation within the dermis


----------



## Dragonfly (Jan 12, 2007)

You certainly have done your homework. As you can see, I'm a great fan of Tetrinoin. And not so much for vit c.

Have you looked into the cost for making a collagen producing product?


----------



## YoursEvermore (Jan 12, 2007)

I know Mario Badescu has a product called "Collagen Moisturizer with SPF 15." I don't know how effective it is, but it's a nice moisturizer in general.  /emoticons/[email protected] 2x" width="20" height="20" />


----------



## Leony (Jan 12, 2007)

*https://forum.makeuptalk.com/f12...gen-26367.html*


----------



## sheil2009 (Jan 12, 2007)

that is the trade name for Retin-a or retinol


----------



## charish (Jan 12, 2007)

this is what i found, but i think it was for acne. Tretinoin may cause side effects. Tell your doctor if any of these symptoms are severe or do not go away:

warmth or slight stinging of the skin

lightening or darkening of the skin

red, scaling skin

increase in acne sores

swelling, blistering, or crusting of the skin

i also read that if irritaion occurs, it won't go away until you stop the treatment. but i'll do some more research.


----------



## Dragonfly (Jan 12, 2007)

Retin A, Renova and Stievaa Vit A acid gel can be prescribed for either acne or for cosmetic purposes.

Tretinoin can causes a burning, irritating sensation. Some people apply too much to often when first starting out. The end result is feeling like a bad sunburn.

If you follow the instructions I gave earlier, these side affects can be avoided.

But as with any prescription, there can be side affects. If you can not tolerate them, definately talk to your doctor or the pharmacist.


----------



## charish (Jan 12, 2007)

ok, thanks, i guess all i can do is try and see how it works for me. do you remember how much of a difference you saw in the begining?


----------



## sheil2009 (Jan 13, 2007)

According to many dermatologists, the initial quality of skin will get worse, and slowely will improve, as your skin is adjusting to the medication


----------



## Dragonfly (Jan 13, 2007)

I'm 43 and I started using Stiervaa Vit A acid gel in my mid 20's. I was using it my face daily to help control oiliness and blackheads. I also used topical medication for cystic acne. Because I needed to use SPF, I started to wear makeup with spf - Revlon I think.

I can remember being 29, and being complemented on my skin. My friend was studying my face and couldn't believe I had no wrinkles or sign of sun damage.

Over the years, I have had similar complements.

Tretinoin is a product that you use as part of your daily skin care. It is not a fast fix and is not offered as such. It will not make a 50 year old look 25. But in my case, it allows me to have healthy, (almost) wrinkle-free skin that I am thrilled with.


----------



## lummerz (Jan 13, 2007)

unless i had a lot of ppl commenting on my collagen count...i don't think i would really bother..but that's just me =)

How often do you really have ppl go..whoa..great boost on that collagen..who did you go see?  /emoticons/[email protected] 2x" width="20" height="20" />

i'm teh cynic!


----------



## charish (Jan 13, 2007)

well, i've always had good skin (i get it from my mom), but since i've moved to fl. and alcohol on top of that, i've noticed my face doesn't look the same. but it didn 't really start changing until after i had my second son who will be 2 in a couple of months.


----------



## lummerz (Jan 13, 2007)

my question is..why are you putting alcohol on your face? it should belong in your cocktails!

hehe, uhm...yea, i know what you mean...alcohol meaning toner? if so, what kind? florida really humid or dry? uhm.. i dunno if your skin is really bad or just slight..but there's a procedure...that is relatively new..plasma resurfacing..and you see improvements after the procedure..immediate improvements and yer skin keeps improving up to a year.

i believe it's called plasma skin resurfacing. they put these goggles on you and a cooling gel on your skin and use this laser instrument (never touches your face) and it's much better..if not..almost infinitely better than the typical skin resurfacing we know. I would totally consider it when the time comes..though dunno if its your thing...but it is permanent. I am wishy about potions and lotions..i read the ingredient list too much and more than half if not..most do nothing but moisturize..so..


----------



## jessiej78 (Jan 13, 2007)

I really think you can, to a certain point. Just wouldn't expect any miracles...


----------



## Dragonfly (Jan 13, 2007)

Rather than rebuilding lost collagen when you are 40 ish, why not try to keep the collagen you have at 20 something.

That's why it is a good Idea to start using Retin A while you are young, and continue to use it as you age, to remain young looking.


----------



## sheil2009 (Jan 13, 2007)

I think I am going to keep harsh drugs off my face, thank you. All I need is a good sunscreen. Why use unecessary and potentially harmful (this stuff is relatively knew; who knows what it could do as you get older) products on my face when I don't need it?


----------



## Siawby (Jan 15, 2007)

My friend is a nursing student and recently told me that collagen in edible or skin care forms are not really effective. The only treatment she says that can really make a difference is by injecting (of course by a doctor) the collagen under your skin. I agree with her about the doubt in edible collagen supplements as our stomach acids would simply break it down before it becomes of use to us.


----------



## Insung (Jan 16, 2007)

Oh lots of knowlege, thanks.


----------



## AquaBlu (Jan 16, 2007)

*LED photorejuvenation lights are advertised as being able to increase the skins natural collagen building. A lot of salons and dermatologists can perform these procedures and there are some home devices available now for $200-$1500.*


----------



## Kathy (Jan 16, 2007)

Thanks Leony for the link. Good article. I think I'm going to start with a Vitamin C regimen.


----------



## charish (Jan 17, 2007)

WOW, nice info, thanks.


----------



## charish (Jan 22, 2007)

hey thanks for the info. i just read this. and no. i'm talking about drinking alcohol. mostly wine. i use to hardly ever drink, but sometime before i got pregnant again i started to often, and them after i had him i got really depressed and have done it almost every night for almost 2yrs. but i've been trying to get my life back and work out again. so if i do drink it's only on weekends. or if it's during the week, not much. but about my skin, i just noticed b/c the sun and heat is stronger here. i don't lay out anymore in yrs. but just from a few burnts, it has made a difference on my skin. use to you couldn't see any pores, no fine lines,and it ,was firm. well not anymore. i do tan easily, but if it's really hot, and i haven't been out in the sun in a long time i'll burn probably within 30min. just starting to , but not bad. i do wear suncreen, but if i'm out on a boat or something, and get busy and forget to reapply, that's when it happens.


----------



## Denicelpz (Feb 1, 2007)

Dr.Ci.Labo Aqua Collagen Gel.Hope this helps


----------



## charish (Feb 1, 2007)

thanks, i'll check it out.


----------



## charish (Sep 19, 2007)

i have been wondering, all this talk about these different creams claiming to build collagen back into your skin, if true or just all talk to sell. anyone know for sure?


----------



## kimford (Sep 20, 2007)

The Alpha Derma CE cream I am using has done a fantastic job in rebuilding my skin's collagen and firming my saggy face. My face looks firmer than it was 5 years ago. So I'd say there are creams that really help.


----------



## Solimar (Sep 20, 2007)

I know a few people, including my mom, who have had success with the OTC creams. It won't make your wrinkles totally go away IMO, but they do improve a lot.


----------



## Dragonfly (Sep 20, 2007)

Tretinoin has been clinically proven to do this.

No idea why women spend tons of money on over the counter cr*p when Retin A is so much cheaper and actually works. Need a prescription from a doctor.


----------



## nelly (Sep 21, 2007)

there are creams that can help re-build collagen and elastin back into the skin.

but they tend to be the more high-end products ..


----------



## Kathy (Sep 21, 2007)

Here's another thread you started on this same subject. :whistling::2: I didn't read it so not sure if their is helpful info. in there or not. :nixweiss:

https://forum.makeuptalk.com/f12...build+collagen

Also...here's an article I found. hth

How to replenish lost collagen?

Most people interested in maintaining youthful skin and reducing wrinkles have heard about collagen. Collagen is a protein (a biological polymer consisting of amino acids) that serves as a key structural component of connective tissue such as skin, bones, ligaments, etc. Dermis, the inner layer of the skin, contains large amounts of collagen whose fibers form a supporting mesh responsible for skin's mechanical characteristics such as strength, texture and resilience. (See our article on the biology of collagen.)

As any material, collagen is subject to wear and tear: it slowly breaks down over time. Skin cells called fibroblasts are capable of producing collagen. When needed, fibroblasts replace broken collagen fibers with new ones. Unfortunately, as we age the skin's ability to replace damaged collagen diminishes and more gaps and irregularities develop in the collagen mesh. This process eventually leads to wrinkles. Thus, a comprehensive approach to wrinkle prevention and elimination involves reducing collagen breakdown and increasing its supply. This task is achievable but you have to go about it the right way.

As far as collgen breakdown goes, many factors that contribute to it can be fully or partially neutralized. They include sun damage, free radicals, some age-related hormonal changes, and smoking. See other articles on this site and Skin Rejuvenation Infopack for further details.

Collagen creams - not the way to go

Collagen has beed used in skin creams for decaded, usually making them more expensive. However, to reduce rather than just cover wrinkles, new collagen must become a part of the skin's inner layer, the dermis. Unfortunately, collagen molecules are too large to penetrate into the dermis when applied to the surface of the skin. Thus, when simply applied in a cream, collagen remains locked outside without affecting the skin structure, at best just temporarily covering wrinkles and helping moisturize the skin.

Transdermal collagen delivery systems

It is true that under normal circumstances, the skin does not allow the penetration of large moleculs like collagen. (And thank God it doesn't -- otherwise we all would have perpetual allergies.) However, there are methods that somewhat increase permeability of the skin to some types of large molecules. There are companies claiming that their products (e.g. Hydroderm) can deliver intact collagen transdermally into the dermis, right where it belongs. If true, this would be a remarkable and welcome achievement. Unfortunately, as of the time of this writing, this claim is supported only by small studies condicted by the company and not published in any of the respected peer-reviewd journals. Whether such a product is worth a try depends on your taste for trying theoretically promising but unproven treatments. In any case, this development is worth watching in case better supportive evidence comes along.

Collagen injections for wrinkles

Another common approach to smoothing wrinkles is collagen injections. Collagen is injected in the skin under the wrinkles in such a way that it pushes the groove of a wrinkle up making it less visible. This procedure does have some noticeable cosmetic effect but has a number of serious drawbacks. On the other hand, some newer incarnations of collagen injections, such as injecting collagen-producing fibroblasts, appear promising. (See our article on the collagen-based wrinkle fillers for details.)

Stimulating your skin to produce more collagen

As was mentioned, aging of the skin shifts the balance between collagen production and breakdown leading to wrinkles, facial sag and rough skin texture. Stimulating skin cells to produce collagen can partly reverse this process. Stimulating collagen synthesis in aged skin was shown to reduce wrinkles and improve skin texture. The benefit of stimulating your own collagen production is that collagen is deposited in an orderly, structured manner and that there is no risk of allergy, immune reaction or injection-induced infection. Furthermore, many ingredients useful in stimulating collagen synthesis are relatively inexpensive and safe.

Stimulation of collagen synthesis in aging skin is realistic and can substantially improve the appearance of fine lines and even deeper wrinkles when done correctly. However, it often requires a comprehensive approach. Production of collagen is a complex process, not unlike the assembly of an automobile. Many parts and assembly tools must come together to efficiently create a product. Similarly, lots of things are needed to efficiently produce collagen:

Vitamin C: Vitamin C (ascorbic acid) is essential for efficient synthesis of collagen. Many of the symptoms of scurvy (vitamin C deficiency disease) such as bleeding gums, skin hemorrhages and poor wound healing a due to impaired collagen synthesis. On the other hand, supplying extra vitamin C can accelerate collagen synthesis especially when other key ingredients are also in abundance. While vitamin C is useful for rebuilding your skin's collagen and reducing wrinkles, it could be of no benefit or even harmful if used improperly. See our articles on using vitamin C and its derivatives to treat wrinkles and rejuvenate skin.

Key amino acids: Like any other protein, collagen consists of amino acids (a type of small organic molecules). Altogether there are 20 different kinds of amino acids in human cells. However, collagen is unusually rich in a few particular amino acids. Supplying these key amino acids in abundance helps stimulate collagen synthesis.

Copper peptides: Certain minerals are also essential for collagen production. One such mineral is copper. Indeed when the level of copper inside skin cells increases, collagen production goes up. However, copper is a potentially toxic metal. Supplements containing more than RDA for copper (2 mg) should not be taken. Simply applying inorganic copper to the skin would do more harm than good because inorganic copper promotes free radical formation. There is a technology that largely circumvents these problems. When copper is converted to organic form by binding to peptides (small fragments of proteins) it can be applied to the skin with relatively low risk. Such copper peptides were shown to promote hair growth and wound healing. They also may prove effective in smoothing wrinkles and firming skin. (See our article about copper peptides for details.)

Growth factors and hormones: To maximize collagen synthesis in the skin, it may not be enough to simply supply cells with all necessary ingredients. Most cells in the body are responsive to a variety of external signals transmitted by signaling molecules such as growth factors and hormones. Some of those signals can switch skin cells into higher gear making them produce more collagen. In fact, one of the reasons why the skin of a child or a young adult produces more collagen than the skin of an older person is that the body's ability to manufacture signal molecules diminishes with age. The challenge is to supply these activators of collagen via topical application.

MMP inhibitors: Unfortunately, not everyone responds to the stimulation of collegen synthesis. A promising alternative or complementary approach is to inhibit breakdown of collagen, which is known to accelerate with age. To learn how this may be done, see our acticle about MMP inhibitors.

Comprehensive Collagen Rebuilding

If you plan to battle wrinkles by enhancing collagen synthesis and/or reducing its breakdown, it is often the easiest to start with one simple and affordable treatment like topical vitamin C or vitamin C derivative. If that doesn't produce sufficient results, a comprehensive approach including some or all of the steps outlined above often works dramatically better.

Source


----------



## charish (Sep 21, 2007)

ok thanks, i don't have wrinkles yet, but my cheeks are what mainly i want to improve(from the sun), and i do have some fine lines, but they're not real bad.

oops, that's right i did ask this awhile back, sorry.


----------



## Kathy (Sep 21, 2007)

That's okay...oliceman: It WAS way back in January. I think I'm going to merge them though, okay?


----------



## mowgli (Sep 25, 2007)

i think microdermabrasion is supposed to stimulate collagen production too..


----------



## Leony (Sep 26, 2007)

Japanese has so many collagen cosmetics stuff.

Next month I'm gonna try this one soon. If it works for me then I won't be buying any serum/night cream anymore because that product is supposed to be ALL in one product.

Ditto.


----------



## grapestain (Sep 27, 2007)

I'm with Carolyn on putting my faith in Retin-A. I'm slowly getting my skin used to a higher percentage right now and going through the "dry stage" where my eye lines are actually looking worse but they say this is only temporary so I'm toughing it out! One thing to remember is that Retin-A use will make your skin even more sensitive to the sun so you need to be extra vigilant about sunscreen use while you're using retinoids.


----------



## charish (Sep 27, 2007)

i've never heard of microdermabrasion doing that, is it just the professional kind or do you know if it can also be from the kind you can use at home. also i tried a product from neutrogena yrs. ago with retin a in it, but i didn't notice any changes, so i don't know how much it had in it. of course that was when i was 20.


----------



## mikaelad (May 21, 2014)

IPL (short for Intense Pulsed Light) is said to stimulate new collagen formation. Here is some info on IPL.


----------



## CajunKitty (May 23, 2014)

Some people swear by needling. When skin is wounded it produces more collagen to repair the damage. I've only tried this once.


----------



## CajunKitty (May 23, 2014)

charish said:


> i was wondering if you could rebuild collagen in your face w/o any procedure or if any of you knew of the best and more permanent procedure.


Okay, I've recently started a regime of facial exercises. This may not produce more collagen, but it has firmed up my face, lips, eyes and neck, so it's almost as good as producing more collagen far as I'm concerned. It's all about looking better.


----------

