# Sick and tired of the F#*ing Oil Companies Screwing us over!!!



## Karren (Apr 30, 2008)

I must be f#*ing stupid or something but how we got into this energy mess just amazes and baffles me. The oil companies are again announcing record high profits and were paying record high gasoline pricesâ€¦. Why are some forms of energy a commodity and some are based on the cost to produce it plus a profit? Why are some regulated by the government and some not? (ie, WTF is with regulated and unregulated electricity)

Oil and Natrual gas are comidities and are traded on exchanges yet coal is a product like bottled water and is sold based on a contract with a customer for certain terms and certain price escalatorsâ€¦ and all three plus nuclear and hydro are used to produce electricityâ€¦. So those people with oil or natural gas fired powere plants your screwed!!!

If the cost of a barrel of crude oil goes up, why does the oil company profits have to go up? It doesnâ€™t cost them any more to convert a barrel of crude into products? Or to pump those products to market? Maybe a slight increase in the cost of transportation to the filling stations because the cost of fuel rose. But the oil companies are announcing 65% increases in profits per quarter!!! The profit per gallon of fuel sold should not be screaming up with the cost of a barrel of crude oil!!! It shouldnâ€™t be a percentage of the total cost of the product especially with such a volatile commodity as oil. Yeah they should be allowed to make more money but this is ridiculous!!!

And another maybe bigger thingâ€¦.. Why when the price of crude oil goes up do the prices at the pump go up immediately?? The cost of the crude that the current gasoline setting in the tank at the filling station was lower when it was produced so the price of that gas should remain lower until the crude oil that they purchase on that day makes its way through the system to that stationâ€¦ Then raise the pricesâ€¦. Say it takes a month for a barrel of crude to be pumped out of the ground, shipped over the ocean, processed, pumped to a terminal, hauled by truck to your filling stationâ€¦. By the oil companies raising the price immediately, they are taking excess profits on gasoline that cost them considerably less to make!!! And thatâ€™s just WRONG!!!!

Why are none of the politicians talking about this? Itâ€™s not rocket science ya know! If I can see this anyone can!!!

Its pure greed and were paying the price!!! And I f#*ing tired of it!!!


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## Aprill (Apr 30, 2008)

In adult terms I like to call this:



getting f*cked in the ass with no grease



There's no other way to describe paying 80 bucks a week in gas for a damn minivan


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## Darla (Apr 30, 2008)

I agree, makes me wonder whats happening in Europe since in most countries $4 gallon was cheap for them .

I think this goes back to no one in this country (Dems or Repubs) having any real energy policy. This goes back to the 70s when we had huge gas lines and odd/even. at least we did in NJ.

what did we do? Not enough towards renewable energy, or more efficient public transportation or anything like that. We got bandaid fixes 55 mph mandates &amp; Jimmy Carter in a sweater (turn down that thermostat). It seems we have been totally at the mercy of the oil companies and things have only gotten worse with the current administration and their cronyism with the industry (ex Cheney with the secret meetings with the oil companies) .

I bet you can start seeing those montrous SUVs become available for a song like you could see those road barges selling in the late 70s.


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## Karren (Apr 30, 2008)

I can't see the spoiler on my Blackberry, Aprill! Lol

This should scare the begebies out of you... I met Mr M King Hubbard in college and heard his presentation on oil reserves...







We are on the down side of the curve and are not finding as many new reserves as were depleting....

Renewables are such a small part of our energy portfoilo right now!! And were double screwed on that since corn I also a comodity, when the corn is shifted to ethenol production then the price goes up and so does our cost of food...

The US's ace in the hole is coal.. 275 billion tons of reserves, 250 years worth! The talk to coal to liquid plant is hot right now. And coal is cheap compared to oil!! since 50% of the electricity comes from coal fired generation... We've got a century to figure out another source of clean affordable energy else the lights will be going out... I fear oil will be gone long before that...


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## Beyonce Welch (Apr 30, 2008)

*Big business runs the world and big oil runs, and their allies, the USA.Just like DeBeers, and their allies run South Africa, Royal Dutch Shell runs Holland, the list can go on &amp; on *


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## Darla (Apr 30, 2008)

Karren,

i was thinking about coal when i was writing my post, but didn't want to include too many things.

the use of corn and that whole aspect of using a major food source as an energy source is coming back to haunt us. Whose great idea was that?

but considering we have a resident expert here. Aren't there other considerations to coal gasification or is this discussion getting way to deep for MuT? (Sorry didn't mean for that last sentence to come off like a slam since we have a lot of people that talk about a broad range of topics here) So what can you do to summarize this Karren?


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## daer0n (Apr 30, 2008)

I know that once you have accepted new information, -I.E. peak oil causes high prices- it is hard to face the fact that you have been decieved. The excerpt below explains some of this dynamic:

Quote:
For a manipulation to be successful strategists follow a well-experimented intellectual ruse: lead (mislead) the reader via endless repetitions of commonplace indoctrinating concepts without providing any proof except pre-packaged opinions and unsubstantiated reports that most readers lack the necessary tools to investigate let alone verify.
This is a cunning practice: it re-recycles previously circulated propaganda themes as verified, settled, and accepted â€œfacts.â€ Example: once the Bush Administration spread the rumor that Iraq threatened the world with weapons of mass destruction, think tanks and media kept repeating that rumor as if it were a solid reality.

Method: a manipulation expert (thinker) transforms those themes into false-facts by the application of what I call, the Principle of Past Thresholds (Colin Powell used this method in his U.N. deceptive presentation in February 2003.) Details: the manipulator applies two processes: mental and psychological, whereby an individual would be inclined to accept re-cycled propaganda themes as â€œfactsâ€ requiring no further verification. At the base of this presumed acceptance is the assumption that the public have already absorbed those themes and passed beyond the threshold of doubt when confronted with them again. Expectation: based on cognitive research, the manipulator knows that consequent to previously stratified inductions, a re-cycled theme would acquire its own â€œcertaintyâ€ because of earlier indoctrinations that made their way into the collective consciousness through mechanical repetitions by legions of others.

By following this intellectual premise, the manipulator of Iraqi and Arab issues expects two possible developments. One: that prior indoctrination would forestall the potential urge to investigate a given matter from a different angle. Two: that the new sequential indoctrination could sink even deeper in the mind of readers since they would probably depend on stored information (disinformation) to make an updated judgment.

Consequent to these processes, a cycle of indoctrination on a subject makes a full circle: because, disinformation was at the root of the earlier judgment, the updated version would be only a matter of rationalized continuity.

â€”â€”â€”â€”â€”â€“
Of course, in a century or so we will exhaust heavy oil and the costlier shale will be developed. There is no ecological advantage in pretending that this is false. We need to confront environmental issues openly and honestly.

Well, letâ€™s say peak oil is real. How do we explain the conspiracy between Hugo Chavez and the U.S. Dept ofEnergy?

Motive? ( how do they gain?)

Means? ( how did they fake the drill results?)

Quote:
â€œMr Chavez told Newsnight that â€œVenezuela has the largest oil reserves in the world. In the future Venezuela wonâ€™t have any more oil - but thatâ€™s in the 22nd Century.â€Venezuela has vast deposits of extra-heavy oil in the Orinoco. Traditionally these have not been counted because at $20 a barrel they were too expensive to exploit - but at $50 a barrel melting them into liquid petroleum becomes extremely profitable.

The DoE estimates that the Venezuelan government controls 1.3 trillion barrels of oil - more than the entire declared oil reserves of the rest of the planet. The US agency also identifies Canada as another future oil superpower. Venezuelaâ€™s deposits alone could extend the oil age for another 100 years.

What about Canada's oil sands? With the price of oil topping $115/brl in the last few days and hitting new record highs daily, the cost of production of the oil sands is now econimcal for those oil companies. Back in 1997-2001 when oil cost $11-$25/brl it was uneconomical for those companies to expand thier operations because it costs anywhere from $13-$17/brl to extract. Now with high prices manipulated from the idea of peak oil, it is profitable to expand. The high cost of oil/gas is there because people will pay those prices plain and simple. It based on a perception that oil has peaked thus supply is low however demand stays high and grows even higher since sept 11/2001 and the 'war on terror'.
Eventually the high cost of oil will force EVERYTHING to rise in price (as we have seen lately with food so on) until there is breaking point and money becomes just another valueless piece of paper. THEN WHAT?

quotes from source


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## Dragonfly (Apr 30, 2008)

Karren,

Maybe if the oil companies were offered a few bobbleheads and t shirts of the Pens, they would be more willing to compromise. Go Montreal!


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## Darla (Apr 30, 2008)

thanks Nury for that post! I really have to read this again to take this all in.

My only thought is to a certain extent people will not put up with the higher costs and you will see a reduction in price. Example the huge SUVs to drive a single person may not be as prevalent. I know this summer we're looking at taking a vacation much closer to home than we might have. I think this will happen across the board.


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## Karren (Apr 30, 2008)

Wait!!! The solution is so simple... Buy oil company stock and take the dividens they pay to buy gasoline for your suv!! Its like a perpetual motion machine!! Hahahaha. Maybe they should pay their dividens in gasoline!! Lol

Kind of like putting big tires on the back of your car and always driving down hill!!


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## Johnnie (Apr 30, 2008)

I hate it too! Sucks for me because I live out in the boonies and to get to any store it's a 15 min drive :-(


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## KatJ (Apr 30, 2008)

In a case like this, there is no such thing as good news, but on the brighter side (maybe), they had a story on the news earlier this week showing how much money the oil companies were making per barrell, and it's way down compared to 2 years ago.

Luckily I drive a Civic. The sad thing is it costs just as much to fill it up now as it took my 87 Buick Regal 3 years ago. And that bad boy got 12 mpg on a good day!


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## Lia (May 1, 2008)

At least here in Brazil, ethanol is quite prevalent, since on many states, it costs half the price of a liter of gasoline - like that, the gas today costs around 2,60 on many states, and the ethanol costs 1,60 (not here on my state, that because of costs of transportation it costs almost the same as gas so it isn't an advantage)

Ethanol here is produced from sugar cane, so it's less likely to influence on food prices , unlike corn which is used for tons of things.


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## Darla (May 1, 2008)

Originally Posted by *Lia* /img/forum/go_quote.gif At least here in Brazil, ethanol is quite prevalent, since on many states, it costs half the price of a liter of gasoline - like that, the gas today costs around 2,60 on many states, and the ethanol costs 1,60 (not here on my state, that because of costs of transportation it costs almost the same as gas so it isn't an advantage)
Ethanol here is produced from sugar cane, so it's less likely to influence on food prices , unlike corn which is used for tons of things.

and unfortunately in the US we have huge tariffs (to protect corn farmers) that prevent us from purchasing Brazilian ethanol.


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## shyiskrazy2 (May 1, 2008)

That is why we will be going to war with Iran and other oil producing countries in the Middle East. Also, in 10 yrs our demand will exceed the supply. Gas will go up to 4 a gal in the summer. I also heard that it will eventually get up to 10 a gal and only the elite will be able to afford to travel. I don't know of any solutions, other than buy a bike and stuff because it will be more expensive down the road. We will go into hyper-inflation as a result of this and our Fed Reserve printing more money than we need to. We must protest and find alternatives to this mess and do it now.


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## daer0n (May 1, 2008)

Originally Posted by *shyiskrazy2* /img/forum/go_quote.gif That is why we will be going to war with Iran and other oil producing countries in the Middle East.... America is already "at war with Iran", they declared war as of march 20th 2008!!
check here for the story.


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## Darla (May 1, 2008)

that's why something like picking the next president is so important. I can't believe people act like they're bored and don't care.


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## KatJ (May 2, 2008)

Careful ladies, we're bordering on having to move this to the politics forum.


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## Darla (May 2, 2008)

my bad


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## Lia (May 2, 2008)

Originally Posted by *Darla_G* /img/forum/go_quote.gif and unfortunately in the US we have huge tariffs (to protect corn farmers) that prevent us from purchasing Brazilian ethanol. Yeah , we know - it kinda sucks for us, but at the same time it's understandable... But at least on USA you buy gasoline by the gallon - 1 gallon is around 4 liters... On countries like UK and here we buy by the liter, so it gets even more expensive.


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## pretty_pink13 (May 3, 2008)

Don't get me started on this...I have to drive 30 min to work everyday and back it sucks....ahhhh


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## bCreative (May 3, 2008)

i know!! just crazy that's what it is. i just got paid and it's already cut in half because of gas alone!!!


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## Annia (May 4, 2008)

Originally Posted by *Karren_Hutton* /img/forum/go_quote.gif I can't see the spoiler on my Blackberry, Aprill! Lol 
This should scare the begebies out of you... I met Mr M King Hubbard in college and heard his presentation on oil reserves...

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/archive/4/41/20060626195221%21Hubbert_world_2004.png

We are on the down side of the curve and are not finding as many new reserves as were depleting....

Renewables are such a small part of our energy portfoilo right now!! And were double screwed on that since corn I also a comodity, when the corn is shifted to ethenol production then the price goes up and so does our cost of food...

The US's ace in the hole is coal.. 275 billion tons of reserves, 250 years worth! The talk to coal to liquid plant is hot right now. And coal is cheap compared to oil!! since 50% of the electricity comes from coal fired generation... We've got a century to figure out another source of clean affordable energy else the lights will be going out... I fear oil will be gone long before that...

Alaska does have oil... but, we're not drilling to protect the wildlife.


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## Bec688 (May 4, 2008)

Tell me about it. The prices just keep getting higher and higher. Over here in Australia, we're paying between $1.40-$1.60 a LITRE for petrol. Luckily I work 5 mins from home, I often walk to walk instead of driving. My poor Dad drives an hour each way to work, he spends so much money in petrol a week it's not funny.


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## StereoXGirl (May 4, 2008)

Originally Posted by *daer0n* /img/forum/go_quote.gif America is already "at war with Iran", they declared war as of march 20th 2008!!
check here for the story.

That's a REALLY long article. I didn't read it all...but what I'm getting from it is that the author views imposing economic sanctions on Iran to be "war"? Correct me if I'm wrong...


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