HELP! AHA, Retin-A, Hyluronic Acid...what products are the best?

[JillyB]

I have begun extensive research on the best skin care regimens and ingredients, but I am now confused!

I have read about Retin-A, AHA, glycolic acid, salicylic acid, Vitamin C, Hyluronic acid, and hydroquinone.  I have even begun to venture into peels.  They all sound like miracle workers but I am not sure in what combination to use them.

I am 25 with combo skin and mild acne (black/white heads in the t-zone).  My pores on my cheeks are medium size, and bigger than I would like.  My skin is tough like teflon, and not sensitive to anything, except for toothpaste oddly enough.  On a regular basis I use Ole Henricksen 3 step regimen (vit c serum, transformation moisturizer, and AHA Night gel), clinique spot corrector, 5% benzoyle peroxide, microderm treatments, and a clarisonic face brush.  My latest treatment was an at home 20% TCA peel about 3 days ago.

I plan to continue with regular TCA peels, but would now like to know what products are best for maintaining my skin and which order to use them in.  Which products are best for AM and which are best for PM, what is best for Pre and Post peel, and what will keep my skin clear young and healthy?

Looking for some much needed advice!  Thanks all /emoticons/[email protected] 2x" width="20" height="20" />

 

[Firefox7275]

IMO that is a very aggressive routine, it seems skewed in favour of products and techniques that damage and dry the skin but little in the way of repair, collagen boosting or hydration. Why so much exfoliation (C serum, AHA gel, microderm, TCA peels, Clarisonic)? Do you apply the BP all over and are you aware it is drying and generates harmful free radicals?

I would caution against thinking of your skin as Teflon, someone I know with that attitude has recently been diagnosed with melanoma. /emoticons/[email protected] 2x" width="20" height="20" /> Over exfoliating can set off a chain reaction of irritation, inflammation and free radical production that can contribute to premature ageing over the long term. Furthermore breaking down the protective upper layers can contribute to acne and blackheads by prematurely sacrificing the epidermis for protection, encouraging oil production or allowing opportunistic bacteria to take hold. Medium size pores on the cheeks screams dehydration which won't be helped by an oil free moisturiser.

Have you got the basics of an anti-inflammatory diet, anti-stress lifestyle, gentle non-foaming cleanser and sunscreen in place? Toothpaste is a fairly common sensitivity, do you experience contact dermatitis (allergy) or irritation?

 

[Dragonfly]

All of the products are right - for the right person.

Sounds like you are a bit aggressive with your skin.

Why not spend a few dollars and get a Dermatologist to analyze your skin.

They will put you on AM and PM routines that will work for your skin.

And they will tell you what products to use, whether you need something prescribed or over the counter, and at which strengths that will be the most effective for you.

 

[Andi]

I agree about seeing a knowledgeable dermatologist. My skin is quite tough as well, but not like Teflon lol.

I think it's fine to use a chemical exfoliator (like a gentle AHA or BHA, or Retin-A) each night. If prefer do mechanical exfoliation (scrub, Clarisonic, at-home microdermabrasion), do that 2-3 times a week. But to be honest, both at the same time aren't necessary or even benefitial IMO. Chemical exfoliators have so many more benefits (above all, collagen stimulation!) than mechanical exfoliators, and it's harder to overdo chem. exfoliators if you stick to a normal application frequency. With a scrub, you can scrub too hard, or press the Clarisonic onto your face too hard etc.

When you use chemical exfoliants regularly, there is no excess dead skin left that you could possible scrub or brush away with a mechanical exfoliator. More than likely, you're causing invisible irritation or micro-swelling (that can make the skin look nicely plump - what a deceiving concept!)

Things like peels should be a once in a while thing. Don't overpeel, that can really harm your skin. I think a low TCA peel is fine once a month, whereas with 20% I would do one every 3 months.

 

[alice blue]

Nothing is as good as Retin A. I use it and Alpha Hydrox for my "foundation" treatments, meaning the heavy-duty stuff, the de-sallowing, the smoothing, the mini-peels. Everything else is just a treat. Nothing can revive skin like a week on Retin A. Cher used Retin A for years and wrote about it in her beauty book. She looks very well preserved, if not entirely lifelike. You can hoist sagging jowls and droopy lids, but it is hard to keep skin looking smooth. 

 

[ChemicalMakeup]

I used Ziana for a while, which is basically the prescription version of Retin-A that's a bit stronger. They both have tretinoin as their primary ingredient. It never really worked and sometimes seemed to make my skin worse and often caused it to get all red. Bella Terra Exfoliating Gel is crazy expensive but it works wonders on my skin

 

[JillyB]

Thank so much for all the input!  

I guess I never really thought about how much I use on my skin, it does sound incredibly aggressive! Toning it down is great advice 

I don't know if it is the amount that I put on my skin that is preventing it from making progress or if I just have really tough skin.  Since posting, I have limited the clarisonic and eliminated the micro-derm.  I use a mild face wash and am only using a simple moisturizer in the morning with sunscreen, and retin-a in the evening.  I loved the peel, so will eventually do another one down the road.

Hopefully removing so much from my skin care routine will help me see better results.  Thanks again for all of the input, will let you know if I see any changes!

 

[JillyB]

Originally I had been exfoliating quite a bit, because I was under the impression that was necessary in order to get rid of the black heads I have on my chin and nose.  Although it now sounds like this maybe the wrong thinking and with yours and others advice I received, have decided to limit this significantly.  I was completely unaware of the BP causing free radicals.  I was using as a spot treatment on my more stubborn blemishes, but have stopped altogether. Again thanks for bringing to my attention that I am over using products and methods.  

I currently live a pretty clean lifestyle, exercise daily, I follow a "clean eating" diet, and am mostly stress free.  So hopefully a simpler routine will help improve my skin.  Thanks again for your input.

With the toothpaste I do experience contact dermatitis.  I was unaware of this until I saw an esthetician who brought it to my attention.  I am now very careful when brushing my teeth. /emoticons/[email protected] 2x" width="20" height="20" /> 

And I am terribly sorry about your friend who developed melanoma. /emoticons/[email protected] 2x" width="20" height="20" /> 

 

[Andi]

Originally Posted by JillyB /img/forum/go_quote.gif

Originally I had been exfoliating quite a bit, because I was under the impression that was necessary in order to get rid of the black heads I have on my chin and nose.  Although it now sounds like this maybe the wrong thinking and with yours and others advice I received, have decided to limit this significantly.  I was completely unaware of the BP causing free radicals.  I was using as a spot treatment on my more stubborn blemishes, but have stopped altogether. Again thanks for bringing to my attention that I am over using products and methods.  

I currently live a pretty clean lifestyle, exercise daily, I follow a "clean eating" diet, and am mostly stress free.  So hopefully a simpler routine will help improve my skin.  Thanks again for your input.

With the toothpaste I do experience contact dermatitis.  I was unaware of this until I saw an esthetician who brought it to my attention.  I am now very careful when brushing my teeth. /emoticons/[email protected] 2x" width="20" height="20" /> 

And I am terribly sorry about your friend who developed melanoma. /emoticons/[email protected] 2x" width="20" height="20" /> 

I think a stronger % of salicylic acid (Paula's Choice has a new 9% salicylic acid treatment for stubborn blackeads. I received it because I was part of the panel test, but it's not available for purchase yet) might help with your blackheads. Or even just a 2% salicylic acid product, unless you're using one already.

Salicylic acid penetrates the pore best if you have oily skin and/or blackheads. I had some stubborn blackheads on my nose (they weren't horribble, but hey I didn't love them either), and that 9% salicylic acid treatment was the first thing that eliminated them! And I had used 10% glycolic, 2% salicylic and Retin-A before that, but nothing cleared up those stubborn blackheads (besides those nose strips, but that effect is VERY temporary)

I haven't heard about BP causing free radicals, but I'm not saying this isn't true. However, free radicals are also caused by UV light, pollution, and they form as a natural process in our bodies. If you're only using BP as spot treatment and not allover (which nobody should anyway), you don't have to be concerned about possible damage.

 

[satojoko]

I use all of them, but not at the same time. Vitamin c is the one I use the least, but from time to time do a vitamin c based mask for up to an hour and a half. I disagree with the person who said nothing compares to retin a. I know several people who have permanent damage to their skin from vitamin a creams, specifically the types that dermatologists and doctors love to hand out. I myself use retinol, not retin a. I also use a glycolic acid cleanser and moisturizer, but not every day. Some days I cleanse my face with my own cleansing mix, other days with goats milk soap, others with oats and a blend of clays. During my period I cleanse with the glycolic acid product. I get hormonal breakouts every month, although they have started to disappear since changing my foundation to a rubbish free indie brand - and find that I MUST use glycolic acid AND retinol during the week before and during my period to keep breakouts under control, as well as to heal anything that erupts faster. The rest of the time I can use my acid products on and off, but I tend to use my retinol serum pretty regularly. I avoid dermatologists like the plague. I have heard some of the most ridiculous things come out of their mouths and no longer trust them. Most don't seem to understand that somebody with a liver full of toxins and garbage will never have clear, healthy skin no matter what they use topically. Whatever is in our liver shows on our skin. Always. I would suggest doing more reading yourself, experiment with products you know won't have serious side effects, and see what's best for you. But don't overstrip your skin with anything. And don't avoid moisturizers with oils in them, as I believe somebody had already mentioned. Your skin WILL overcompensate for those stripped & missing oils, leading to more blackheads and whiteheads. And please please do more research on hydroquinone. I've met many women, especially while living in South East Asia where whiter skin is prized and whitening products sell by the billions, who have absolutely atrocious damage to their skin from using products with that ingredient in them. I couldn't believe my eyes. Really horrible stark white and contrasting dark patches that they are scarred with for life. Do some google image searches for that and you'll see what I mean.

 

[JillyB]

I would love to try that 9% salicylic acid if and when it comes out!  I have been using the 2% off and on for years, and don't really feel like I have seen it make a difference.  I was actually switching back and forth between the BP and SA, and I hadn't found one to be more effective than the other.  Both work as peeling agents, and the difference between the two is that BP has harsher chemicals and kills the bacteria, where SA is a plant based beta hydroxy  that is more gentle on skin.  They both work to achieve the same results, peeling of the skin.  

I have done some minor research and found that BP is linked to free radicals, cancer, and was labeled as a category 1 product, safe by the FDA and has been changed to category 3, safety unknown.  Here is the link to the info I found if you are interested in reading http://www.highonhealth.org/do-not-use-benzoyl-peroxide-to-treat-your-acne/  definitely unsettling information and can now see the connection between BP and melanoma.

 

[Firefox7275]

Are you still using commercial toothpaste, and do you know if it is the sulphate content or the fluoride that was the trigger? If so IMO get that out of your routine because inside your mouth is still skin, the toothpaste still a challenge/ irritant so can still be triggering low grade inflammation at a cellular level. It's a royal PITA if you allow minor sensitivity to progress to full blown contact dermatitis, probably more so if you are used to young skin that bounces back from anything. Are there sulphate surfactants in your facial cleanser/ shampoo/ hand wash or fluoride in your mouth wash?

Salicylic acid is an exfoliant and will dry the skin if used frequently at a low strength; however if used at higher strengths but less frequently SA can also 'clean' inside pores. You can purchase ready made peels or dilute your own simply and cheaply; start conservative with percentage and time and slowly work your way up hopefully as you did with the TCA. Obviously don't start SA until the TCA is well healed (not just on the surface) but, once you get the pores clear-ish, you can return to TCA or alternate between the two. This way you can leave the daily gentle exfoliation to your Clarisonic or Retin-A. I am not personally dead against the Clarisonic just wary of people using it too aggressively, using some of the cleansers they sell, or anything but the extra gentle head. I believe you are not supposed to be able to feel the Clarisonic working if you have it positioned correctly, so I imagine it must be very tempting to press just a little harder.

If you haven't already please see a dermatologist that has been recommended to you regarding the Retin-A, just as a one off is fine. Agree wholeheartedly with Satojoko that too many medics know nothing about lifestyle healthcare or do not promote it, but Retin-A is a prescription drug and you should get a professional's guidance on scaling up usage, risks and red flags. This advice comes from someone who once trained in hospital pharmacy but now works in lifestyle healthcare, so has dealt with medics from both ends of the spectrum! Lucky me.

 

[Mariajose]

Hi, Mine is a dry skin and i am 35, I have wrinkles under my eyes which makes me depress. Do you know any lotion or products which is good for this wrinkle problems.

 

[Guest]

You all have given me no answers. I do see a dermatologist.  He would tell me to never use this. I bought it before I saw professional care. I was just curious. And ..Bella Terra is not expensive.  The real stuff is more. But, goes further..Last longer, better for you!